Hei

[81laredo]

I have been reading about the HEI distributors and decided on the CRT. CRT states that they use the proper gear and it will not produce problems with the cam gear, don't know if I should trust them.
It has been discussed that you should use your old gear and move it to the new distibutor. The shafts are not the same size though, AMC = .535" and the new CRT = .485".
1st) those of you with the CRT...how long has it been in and any problems?
2nd) did those who did the gear change use a bushing and is it worth it?
thanks in advance

 

[81laredo]

Re: Hei 6 Cylinder

I forgot to post that this is the AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l L 6 Cylinder

 

[tinman]

Not sure on the CRT, but I put an HEI in my AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l this spring. So far, so good! From what I gathered before buying one, the issue with the gear only had to do with the V-8, not the AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l .:dunno:

 

[81laredo]

cool, thanks for the reply.

 

[MN CJ7]

Not sure on the CRT, but I put an HEI in my AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l this spring. So far, so good! From what I gathered before buying one, the issue with the gear only had to do with the V-8, not the AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l .:dunno:

I have seen a few folks on this CJ forum say this.... NOT true

The hard gear is a issue for the AMC V8 and I6 cylnder engines....

This is a specific problem with the AMC engines and there was a flood of hardened gears released in the market. Will take some time to get these out of the market. Do some reading by Jeephammer the founder and fixer of this issue on JeepForum and you will see this is a V8 and I6 issue that is wide spread for both...

With use of the cheapee HEI distributors There are also some fitment issues and users should be well read. The best write ups are on the Jeepfourm and done by JeepHammer. He is the one that saved our buts and forced the industry to change.

Jeepers should learn how to fix and recurve the 70s and 80s ford/jeep distributors. The process needed to change the 70s is different than the 80's computer controled engines. It is a good little distributor one of the best ones made for stock OEM. Jeephammer also has tons on posts on the internet about this also...

I am still running the orginal 1978 distributor and my jeep runs just like brand new. Idles 600, runs to 4500 rpms, and stared right up after being stored outside in a terrible MN wiinter with -30F MINUS F temps on the first turn of the key. High ideled, then low ideled, put my stuff away and in 3 minutes drove off down the road and it work great for being stored ouside for 5 months in common temps from 15 to -20 as normal temps.

 

[CJim7]

I have seen a few folks on this CJ forum say this.... NOT true

The hard gear is a issue for the AMC V8 and I6 cylnder engines....

This^
Research the parts you are purchasing....you do not want to install a hardened dizzy gear...it will eat the cam gear in no time.

 

[81laredo]

Does anyone know what gear that CRT is using? that was my original question. In order to use the original Distributor Gear it will take some Machine Work, is it worth it? if not why bother.

MN CJ7 ;
Not so sure that the stock distributor is the best way to go. The FORD stuff is pretty much junk as far as I am concerned. The HEI is a GM Distributor that has been adapted to an AMC (or should I say FORD?) 6 cylinder engine. I think that the engine is a good one but the Carburetor and Ignition are the downfall.

While doing the HOWELL EFI (90's GM EFI) I was able to eliminate a large bundle of wires, a very poor Carburetor, almost 40' of Vacuum Hose and a couple of Electronic Modules. Once I was done I looked at the FORD Distributor with the Electronic Module 5 Wires, Coil, Resistor, etc. and thought why not complete the up-grade?

Remember I need this to pass California Smog Testes every other year.

 

[CJim7]

I think you're confused....or maybe I am
The Ford upgrade (TFI) is a huge improvement over the stock AMC . Utilizing the cap, rotor, coil, and wires from a Ford 300cid, you gain as much if not more spark performance then the HEI (all debatable)...and it's all bolt-on.

I ran a TFI ignition for years on my AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l and loved it...I now run a TFI from a Ford 460 on my 401 and my ignitions system is beyond crisp.

The attractive point of the TFI is you dont have to bother with the bottom end of your dizzy...which is the source of grief with any dizzy swap.

 

[BusaDave9]

Its hard to separate fact from hype regarding the gear on the CRT Distributor. I see some places on the internet that say you need to swap out the CRT gear with a stock gear.
Some say they already use an OEM gear (iron not steel). CRT's website says they use a hardened gear: Jeep HEI's
81laredo, where did you get the specs that indicate you can't swap out the gear (wrong shaft sizes)
I am not going to get into the debate concerning whether the GM HEI is better or worse than a ford TFI. They are both superior to the AMC ignition in your jeep. IMHO the ignition is one of the best places to improve on AMC performance.
From what I have read replacing the distributor can be scary because of issues with the gear. Check out these links regarding the CRT Distributor and its gear:

Anyone put a CRT HEI distributor on their FSJ? - International Full Size Jeep Association

hei distributor upgrade for 258 - JeepForum.com

CRT HEI cam gear question - JeepForum.com

 

[81laredo]

The Factory 1982 AMC is Ford, my Distributor and Vacuum Advance says MOTORCRAFT all over it. I can attach a pic if needed but I am glad to be done the SMOG related .
Basically I think that the AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l is a good engine it is all of the auxiliary stuff () that makes tHis engine unreliable.
my story and I am sticking with it!
PS if you want any of the stock stuff, I have 3 Exhaust Manifolds, Carburetors, ECMs, distributors, and Control Modules and you can have them for cheap, otherwise they will be filed in my round file .

PSS. thanks for the up-date on the CRT Distributor, while these posts are a couple of years old I will re-evaluate using their Distributor Gear.
I measured the Distributor Shafts myself the AMC Distributor Shaft is .535 and the CRT Distributor Shaft is .485. These measurements are made with a set of Digital Calipers (if questioned I can use a Micrometer) but when I tried to install the AMC Gear it had too large a diameter for the CRT Distributor Shaft. The Original AMC Gear will not be able to be installed on the CRT Distributor without some Machine Work and most likely a bushing. This is why I made the post.

 

[MN CJ7]

The Factory 1982 AMC is Ford, my Distributor and Vacuum Advance says MOTORCRAFT all over it. I can attach a pic if needed but I am glad to be done the SMOG related .
Basically I think that the AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l is a good engine it is all of the auxiliary stuff () that makes tHis engine unreliable.
my story and I am sticking with it!
PS if you want any of the stock stuff, I have 3 Exhaust Manifolds, Carburetors, ECMs, distributors, and Control Modules and you can have them for cheap, otherwise they will be filed in my round file .

PSS. thanks for the up-date on the CRT Distributor, while these posts are a couple of years old I will re-evaluate using their Distributor Gear.
I measured the Distributor Shafts myself the AMC Distributor Shaft is .535 and the CRT Distributor Shaft is .485. These measurements are made with a set of Digital Calipers (if questioned I can use a Micrometer) but when I tried to install the AMC Gear it had too large a diameter for the CRT Distributor Shaft. The Original AMC Gear will not be able to be installed on the CRT Distributor without some Machine Work and most likely a bushing. This is why I made the post.

Test the CRT gear for hardness by drilling it a little with a std drill bit... If it drills then it is std steel and can be used. The hardened gears are not touched by a std drill bit. Do not need to go wild with bit just a little divit. Compair the cut of teeth to the std gear they should be the same.

Then look at the lenght from the mtd shoulder to the gear they should be the same. Some have been too long and bind the oil pump and cause engine failure.

Some of the HEI distirbutors have been know to have too much advance... you do not sound like a rookie and have a few vehicles are your sign in info. If you have a time light and can use balancer tape to plot your advance curve or have a digital time light to plot the tota, mech, vac...... its a pretty good idea. Some have been found to have 45-55 deg of total advance and its too much.

Target total advance is 32 to 35 deg and the curve is in the '78 to 80 FSM manuals....These are the pre computer years and a good match for all distributors.

The 82 and newer Jeep/AMC/Ford distributors have 5 or 8 deg of mech advance for choices... Once you remove the computer, do the nutter bypass, they just do not work right. They can be modified and made to run like the 1978 I have... it has 13 and 18 deg of mechanical advance... Makes a big difference in hyw mileage and pep.

If you have Motorcraft Distributors and Ignition Moduals...... I can put them to work in other jeepers rigs. I do several a year. I can mod the distributor to increase the mech advance and set the vacuum advance to it works with the vac levels of engine/carb. I like the OEM distributor and the orginal spark moduals hold up pretty well. I am also a big fan of the DuraSpark Distributor and a Multispark CDI combo and is what I run....

Be happy to pay for shipping for the Dist & Spark Ignition Modual and put them back to work.... if you are going to toss them...

Calf 1981 and 1982 for the rest of the USA are distributors that have to be modified to work welll..... These have very Limited advance and will not work well. I know how to make the modifications and w/o the modificaitons the distributors are junk as you say.

Jeephammer has some nice write ups on this stuff if you want to look or want more info.


Ck out those 4 things on your crt and you shoudl be ok.
Test drill the gear
Verify the mtd flange bottom to gear is same lenght
Verify the gear is cut the same as the OEM one
Good idea to ck the advance curve so the engine does not get damaged

 

[81laredo]

Thank you MN CJ7 ! That is exactly the information that I was looking for, I'll send you a PM after I get the engine running and know that it runs right. I simply took a file and confirmed that the gear was hardened. Thankfully my neighbor has a machine shop in his basement so he he machined a bushing for the AMC Gear and it is now on the Distributor and in the Engine

A word of caution to anyone looking at the CRT HEI Distributor!!! The Gear is Hardened and the AMC Gear does not go one without Machine Work.

 

[mylittlecj5]

I've been following this thread since I found 2 of the CRT distributors in boxes while in the new shop...Now I dunno if I wanna try and use one or not! lol
Gotta look closer at them and see if I can figure them out, using this thread as a guide.
Thanks!

 

[81laredo]

from what I have been able to digest I would go with the CRT BUT I would change out the Distributor Gear as I stated. Take an Original AMC Distributor Gear off of an original Distributor. Take this Gear to a Machine Shop and have them make a Bushing, Press it in with about .001" Interference and the Bore it to the proper Shaft Size.
Actually after what I have found out I would have bought a Junk Yard Distributor and had the Machine work done but since you already have a Distributor what not use it?

 

[MN CJ7]

from what I have been able to digest I would go with the CRT BUT I would change out the Distributor Gear as I stated. Take an Original AMC Distributor Gear off of an original Distributor. Take this Gear to a Machine Shop and have them make a Bushing, Press it in with about .001" Interference and the Bore it to the proper Shaft Size.

Actually after what I have found out I would have bought a Junk Yard Distributor and had the Machine work done but since you already have a Distributor what not use it?

Not sure if you are talking HEI Junkyard find or a Motorcraft/Jeep Junk yard distributor???

Cardone sells at Jeep Distributor remanufactured for $50 with a lifetime warranty...... I have used them... and they work well.... Look down the hole and you can see the stamp on the mech advance slot and look for the 13 or 18 deg marking.... those are the pre computer versions and the ones you want.... MATCH this with a CDI multispark igntions and you have the best igntion you can get and is several times better than the HEI or the stock AMC... Actualy the HEI and AMC are equal and the AMC is better in MHO.... due to several reasons in JeepHammers write ups... one would be a retard start advance of 8 degrees for easier starting.

The CDI can be now had for $AMC 150 to 200 vs $500-600 a few years ago. This means the average guy can have the best ignition for cheap. I leave the stock ignition there wires and all. Then add the CDI it comes with all its own wires and batter connections... and its the best igntions. Do this and you can change coil wires, move distributor fire signal to stock ignition modual, and hook up the aux ground for stock AMC ignition (jeepers need aux ground for igntion) and it works in a matter of minutes. When you sell the jeep pull the CDI, leave the stock ignition, and use the CDI on the next project....

I love they way my jeep runs.... it runs as well as my NEW 1973 Jeep ran and its 33 years old.

I did all the stuff Jeephammer writes about, it works.

 

[81laredo]

Respectfully disagree. That Cardone Distributor through O'Reilly is $90.00;
List: Distributor - 1975 Jeep CJ6 | O'Reilly Auto Parts

I wanted to eliminate all of the SMOG stuff and extra wiring This Motorcraft Distributor that was on my'81 has a Module with 5 Wires in 2 Plugs going to a Coil with 4 wires in 1 Plug going to a Distributor with 1 Plug. All of this has now been replaced with 1 Distributor and 2 Wires, job accomplished!

I understand that some will continue to hold on to this older equipment but you most likely do not need to have a California SMOG check every other year. The SMOG checks do put another twist into our up-grades.

 

[MN CJ7]

Respectfully disagree. That Cardone Distributor through O'Reilly is $90.00;
List: Distributor - 1975 Jeep CJ6 | O'Reilly Auto Parts

??????????????

ORiley Website

Lifetime warranty...





Cardone Remanufactured - Ignition Distributor

$49.99 Each
Plus Core - $15.00
Buy


Add to Printable List
Online: Available

Call Store: Usually Avail. 24 Hrs

Find store with item

• Limited Lifetime Warranty
• Remanufactured
• Without Module
• With Motorcraft Distributor

Part # : 30-4691 | Line: A1

 

[MN CJ7]

No I get ya.... simple is very nice....
I am so glad not to have the CALF type regulations....
I do not even have to test my classic jeep, mine runs great but who needs the hassles

This is a 1978 with stock ignition. Simple.... PCV, vac advance, stock spark box, stock distributor..... gets 20 mpg. After the addition of CDI the hwy mpg jumped to 24/25 rejeted carb and tunned and get a nice 23 mpg... it runs great!





Added the Summit CDI and now that MSD has lowered their price more to the $AMC 150 -170 range.... I would go that route... This bumped me to 23 mpg hwy with 33x12.5 all teriran radials...

I have purchased MSD CDIs for as little at $30 and installed them on other jeepers rigs.

The CDI has +-, adapter to plug into stock distributor trigger, attached to coil to power it, and use the soleniod to turn it on/off. It comes with all the wires. This is THREE sparks per cylinder and always full voltage & current.

I left the OEM stuff and can use for back up... Move two wires to coil, change the plug to distributor fire signal, reattach the aux ground. In five minutes I can change back to stock for trouble shooting, trail failure, or to pull the CDI and use for the next project..

 

[81laredo]

agreed simple is nice and CA SMOG is a hassle.
I went with the Howell EFI Kit and when I ordered it I was asked if I had an MSD Ignition, something about feedback. I am sure that there is a cure but I was on a mission to simplify and that is why I went with an HEI Distributor. For whatever reason they did not have a problem with it.
Anyway, I got close enough to start the CJ7 yesterday. Turned the Key, heard the Fuel Pump and it started with no issues. Timing was only off a few degrees and after I set that it idled smooth and ran better than it has in a while. I still have some tidying up to do but it should be driven in a few days after I get the new Tailpipe.

 

[81laredo]

Here is a quick update on the CRT HEI.
1) It does have much more than 35 Degrees Full Advance. It doesn't look too hard to adjust this but it looks like the Distributor needs to come out and apart to do this.
2) My Original in dash Tachometer (Laredo CJ7 ) doesn't work with this HEI Distributor. I have ordered a replacement Tachometer from Collins Brothers and should have it by the weekend. I chose them because they had it in stock and could ship today.