Newbe - help 304 - starting issues

[cstephan]

Guys, i just bought a CJ5 . I am new to motors that have carburetors. I have always worked around Fuel Injection. So my issue is, this motor was rebuild with a RV cam before I got it, it also has a larger ford MDS disturber. It has a edelbrock 4 barrel carb (1406) and a performer intake manifold. I don’t know where to start. It runs great after its started cold, fires right up! Runs strong. When you shut her down, and leave her set for 3min or more it doesn’t like to start, sometimes puffs black smoke (previous owner advanced the timing because he thought it was fouling plugs “doesn’t sound right to me”) when I spoke to him, he told me to retard the timing, I did so, and she started right up, but then she has no power at all! Guys can you help me, maybe a list of what I might want to try first (and set up right). And also, I would like to know how to correctly set timing up that has vac advanced. The vac advanced is ported to the “full-time vac port” any help is greatly appreciated – this is my first jeep

-Also, to get her to start after she is warm, i have to crank for about 5-10 sec with my foot slowly pressing on the throtle (almost like clearing vac or...) i have adjusted the idle fuel back some, helped a little bit, she idles better now. but still starts like a struban mule

 

[007]

I'd say timing and advance are indeed issues. If it starts fine cold on one timing setting, then does not start at all when warm on the same timing then that says something. If retarding the timing allows it to start when warm, lets see if it starts on that setting when it's cold. That would give you a mere starting point.

From there it's the usual things. The vacuum advance is pretty straight forward and usually only applies (actuates) during acceleration and levels out once the RPM reaches a plateau. If your advance is getting the SAME vacuum all the time, it may not be working correctly and adding to the issues both listed above, and the issues you describe in your original post.

Now, as for the carb - that's whole other animal. I'd look for docs on good starting points for the carb and make sure you level-set before you go about fiddling with every possible contributor to your symptoms (as I have done in the past). Get a solid foundation from which to work from, that will make the rest of the process that much easier to work and the root cause easier to isolate.

 

[cstephan]

007,

do you have a procedure that i can follow as far as setting timing up? does the VAC advanced need to be disconnected to set up intal timing. should i have the vac advanced routed to the "ported vac port" on the carb. Could i be heat soaking the carb? i am going to watch it tonight after she is warm, to make sure its not flooding its self as well, or leaking fuel down from the carb after shut down, i want to try and rule out everythign befor i go and rebuild or mess with the carb jets.

 

[007]

I would make sure that you disconnect the advance to set initial timing and I'm pretty sure mine is connected to the carb. These can leak down if the fuel filter is in the wrong position or the check valve in the fuel pump is bad (or both in my case).

 

[mtnwhlr]

First you vac advance should be hooked to ported vac. second it sounds like after you shut it off it's flooding the carb. Do you have a return line to the tank? If you do you may have a weak needle and seat with the float and a carb rebuild would help. If it is flooding when restarting try holding the gas pedal to the floor it will help.

 

[Turbogus]

"Black Betty" came with that Edelbrock (Carter AFB clone) 1406 you're running. It had similar issues that your're mentioning and in one instance during a backfire she spat fuel onto the air cleaner horn and caught fire. Luckily my first purchase after getting this old CJ was to buy and mount a fire extinguisher.
From my hot rodding days my best friend bought my Carter AFB 'Black Stallion" (whoopie doo what powder coated black) that I used to run on a 350 Chevy. I bought it back from him and adjusting the jets and rods (took about half an hour) and 'BB's been running fine since, hot or cold, sitting a spell or immediate restart. I suspect there's something inherently different about these Carter clones and the genuine article, but I could be wrong.