Another Steering Wandering Psycho 65mph Question!

[Techlight]

I know this question has been done before so I won't bore you with too many details...but I was curious if slop in the steering shaft can cause poor steering as well. And if so how and can someone explain how much slop is too much etc.

Up around 60ish my Jeep rides fine, no bump steer, straight as an arrow, but if I'm hit by a gust of wind or have to make sudden steering it gets into this situation where it feels like I'm over-correcting even though I'm not. Kind of this back and forth until my speed is reduced...this is usually when my heart begins to beat as well haha. Kinda feels like I'm turning the wheel and nothing is happening for about 2 inches and then "steering gets applied" all of a sudden. I can drive my way out of this without reducing my speed my making very slight corrections, but I feel as if I got in some dangerous position (needing to swerve or a flat tire) I'd be done for and the new motor and money i've spent will be worthless, lol. Also I have noticed that my ride does not return to center on it's own if that's of any consequence.

I never got to drive the jeep before I overhauled a ton of stuff on it so i have no idea how it handled before. Unfortunately, I have touched everything that could cause this problem: 1 inch body lift, spring and shackle bushings, swaybar bushings. The ball joints feel fine to me but I haven't checked the steering linkage. I also have not had the alignment checked. It just feels like there is too much response in the steering even though there's a lot of slop on the wheel.

So that's a long way to my questions but...is there a way to check my steering shaft properly? And can this cause what I'm describing.

Also can my old tired springs cause this?

And while we're at it does anyone have an opinion on the heavy duty omix steering shaft? Or am I better off with the Borgeson one with the fancy vibration dampening?

Thanks for putting up with this steering question haha ...I'm sure my next stop will be to an alignment shop just to rule that out.

 

[tarry99]

I know this question has been done before so I won't bore you with too many details...but I was curious if slop in the steering shaft can cause poor steering as well. And if so how and can someone explain how much slop is too much etc.

Up around 60ish my Jeep rides fine, no bump steer, straight as an arrow, but if I'm hit by a gust of wind or have to make sudden steering it gets into this situation where it feels like I'm over-correcting even though I'm not. Kind of this back and forth until my speed is reduced...this is usually when my heart begins to beat as well haha. Kinda feels like I'm turning the wheel and nothing is happening for about 2 inches and then "steering gets applied" all of a sudden. I can drive my way out of this without reducing my speed my making very slight corrections, but I feel as if I got in some dangerous position (needing to swerve or a flat tire) I'd be done for and the new motor and money i've spent will be worthless, lol. Also I have noticed that my ride does not return to center on it's own if that's of any consequence.

I never got to drive the jeep before I overhauled a ton of stuff on it so i have no idea how it handled before. Unfortunately, I have touched everything that could cause this problem: 1 inch body lift, spring and shackle bushings, swaybar bushings. The ball joints feel fine to me but I haven't checked the steering linkage. I also have not had the alignment checked. It just feels like there is too much response in the steering even though there's a lot of slop on the wheel.

So that's a long way to my questions but...is there a way to check my steering shaft properly? And can this cause what I'm describing.

Also can my old tired springs cause this?

And while we're at it does anyone have an opinion on the heavy duty omix steering shaft? Or am I better off with the Borgeson one with the fancy vibration dampening?

Thanks for putting up with this steering question haha ...I'm sure my next stop will be to an alignment shop just to rule that out.

Plain and simple...........any and all components attached to the steering system from the steering wheel to the hubs and tires including front and rear suspension can be suspect and needs to be checked.

You really need two people to properly check portions of the system out. Every movement from the steering wheel to the tires is basically on a 1:1 ratio. So have someone move the steering wheel and watch the shafts starting at the steering wheel end.........loose tie rods, loose joints, loose bolts and loose suspension and worn out steering gear are all things to look at.

There is a link on this site that goes into more detail to trouble shoot this.

 

[billyballer]

To tag onto the above post.
Put a wrench and pair of eyes on all your suspension parts. I know it takes time, but just re-torque everything (u-bolts, shackles, hangers, steering box mounts, sway bar mounts and links etc).
After that I would take a close look at the steering box mount (these things love to crack and break and can cause lots of steering havoc).

Also check your tie rod ends. Use big channel locks and try to compress them. If you can do it easily they need replacing.

The stock steering shaft is pretty funky on the lower end. I've had one come apart, and it caused the steering to bind and eventually not steer at all (yikes).

As for the springs, I'm sure worn springs could cause issues, but seems like they would have to be really weak to get the problems your seeing. Shocks might be good to check though.

Based on your description it really sounds like worn bushings, tie rods, or steering box mount to me.

 

[mtnwhlr]

Also I have noticed that my ride does not return to center on it's own if that's of any consequence.

Do you mean the steering wheel doesn't return to center? If so it sounds like the steering box has a lot of play in it and somebody tried to adjust it out with the adjustment screw on the top and now its to tight. Which will cause this.

 

[Techlight]

Thanks for the replies y'all...exactly the kind of info I was looking for. I know there was that other guy bashing this forum but I get nothing but solid answers and not once has anyone given me trouble. Of course I did read some before posting but I know it's a duplicate kind of question all the same.

There's a few things I will check like shackles and stuff but after that it sounds like a front end shop is in my future. I'll probably take it there to have it inspected and then change the parts out myself depending on what's wrong.

Too many variables for me troubleshooting and I would just like to be sure. Especially if it ends up being that steering box adjustment...have no clue on that one. I'd really kinda like someone with some experience to handle it haha...it's a bit too white knuckle for me to get wrong...I'll post back eventually when I get it sorted.

Thanks again...Love this forum.

 

[Old Dog]

I would check the coupler at the bottom of the shaft, they like to wear out and get slop. If your looking at a new shaft than go Borgeson.
Both caster and toe in can cause the wheel to not return to center.

 

[mstar]

Reading down thru your post and thinking about several other folks with handling problems on there jeeps it occured to me that the ball joints get over looked quit often. I would think that if I bought a 30 year old vehicle with no history and the steering was as stiff as you say the FIRST thing I would do is pull that steering knuckle of and replace the ball joints,check and or replace axle u-joints,repack wheel bearings and adjust and then see how it drives.Just because the ball joint doesn't have play in it(how many on here know how to test them) doesn't mean its ok.Could be dry as a bone.I just replaced the ball joints,bearing hubs,axle u-joints and all drive shaft u joints as routine maintenance on my 2004 TJ with 120,000 miles.These parts don't last forever.What i'm trying to say is you really need to get to the heart of the steering on a vehicle that is that old
and no history about it.mike s.

 

[mstar]

Just as a addendum to my post I am not trying to cause trouble or anything like that.All the posts have great suggestions on parts to inspect for wear .They all play a part in the big picture.Hope you find my comments useful.I did change my ball joints myself with a H/F kit.Not much fun to say the least,but it's done now. Cheers, mike

 

[DHugg]

Don't overlook the bearing race at the lower end of the steering column. These are prone to come out of the race and fall out, causing a wobbly steering column to move the steering shaft in funny ways.

How do I know? I don't have 'nar a BB in the lower column race, and she steers like a cow on ice. But Real Soon Now............

 

[RM77CJ5]

I would check the coupler at the bottom of the shaft, they like to wear out and get slop. If your looking at a new shaft than go Borgeson.
Both caster and toe in can cause the wheel to not return to center.

Borgeson offers the 1" DD shaft? Or just the splined? I'm looking at replacing the wife's steering column and going with a 1" DD. Any help?

 

[gutthans]

Everyone has covered the stuff already...Here's my personal twist on it:

Steering box has a bit of play that can be ALMOST tightened out IF you find the documentation for adjustment. Most shops will not do this as there is more money in just replacing the box for you.

Soft, old bushings add play. Easy to change.

Lower ball joints will do Exactly as you describe btw It only takes one to do it.

Steering coupler and lower bearing add play. Check and replace or you can use Metallic A/C type tape to wrap the column area and decrease bearing loosenes where it mounts.

The upper steering bearing can go south and add play...if you need one , I have one in the pack from Crown that I never used...$10 + mailing. I'll send you the part number for the one I have if you're interested so you can check.

 

[Barry2]

Check your caster or have it checked, not enough caster and you get no self centering. Had the same problem and used wedge between spring and spring saddle.

 

[tarry99]

Everyone has covered the stuff already...Here's my personal twist on it:

Steering box has a bit of play that can be ALMOST tightened out IF you find the documentation for adjustment. Most shops will not do this as there is more money in just replacing the box for you.

Soft, old bushings add play. Easy to change.

Lower ball joints will do Exactly as you describe btw It only takes one to do it.

Steering coupler and lower bearing add play. Check and replace or you can use Metallic A/C type tape to wrap the column area and decrease bearing loosenes where it mounts.

The upper steering bearing can go south and add play...if you need one , I have one in the pack from Crown that I never used...$10 + mailing. I'll send you the part number for the one I have if you're interested so you can check.

That adjustment is there just to set pre-load on the two gears and bearings and is measured in just a few inch pounds when making that adjustment. It should also be noted that this is not an adjustment or substitute for a worn out gear box.

 

[gutthans]

That adjustment is there just to set pre-load on the two gears and bearings and is measured in just a few inch pounds when making that adjustment. It should also be noted that this is not an adjustment or substitute for a worn out gear box.

Well, sort of...you can set the clearance on the worm/bearing with the big end nut and , and decrease the center flat spot a wee bit by bringing the sector shaft (did I say that right?) closer with the turn down screw on the top. It also helps to remove the top cover and drill it for a grease fitting so you can fill the box with moly or wheel bearing grease (that makes it a bit smoother. at least to me)...But , yea...a worn out gear is a worn out gear!