Carb ?

[kickstart]

Little history first, I have a 83 CJ5 that I bought used, the VIN tells me that it came with a 4 cyl but it has an in line 6. The carb is a Weber 2 barrel with DGAV, 32/38 D6 stamped in the side.

The automatic choke kept sticking so I picked up a manual choke kit, removed the cover and the spring, installed the manual kit and the carb is still acting like it has an automatic choke.

I also made a bracket to spring load the choke rod so there is no doubt the choke is off.

Any help, ideas, etc would be appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Torxhead]

Are you able to watch the manual choke operation? Is the choke opening and closing as you operate it manually.

 

[sjc115]

...and the carb is still acting like it has an automatic choke.

Can you be more specific? Could it be a jetting issue rather than a choke issue?

 

[JR74CJ5]

The automatic choke kept sticking

the carb is still acting like it has an automatic choke.

I also made a bracket to spring load the choke rod so there is no doubt the choke is off.

By sticking do you mean it was actually cutting off air while it was warm, and should have been fully open? Or that the RPM's were too high and standard kick-down (hit the pedal) wasen't working?

When you say still acting like automatic, how so? RPM's still?

The last sentence (know the choke is off from spring" along with my assumption of the top two, make me think you may have more of a Throttle kick-down issue?

I may be way off base here...


~ JR

 

[kickstart]

Are you able to watch the manual choke operation? Is the choke opening and closing as you operate it manually.

Yes the choke is opening and closing and it's also spring loaded to make sure it's not on.

 

[kickstart]

Can you be more specific? Could it be a jetting issue rather than a choke issue?

When the engine is started it idles up/races and after it warms up a bit and I rev it up a few times the idle drops down to normal.

Can I say for certain that it's not a jetting issue, no.

 

[kickstart]

I removed the cover and spring and put on the manual choke kit.
It still idles high until it warms up and then you can hit the gas and it will idle down.
I made a bracket and spring loaded the choke arm so it is always open unless you hold it closed with the cable.

By sticking do you mean it was actually cutting off air while it was warm, and should have been fully open? Or that the RPM's were too high and standard kick-down (hit the pedal) wasen't working?

When you say still acting like automatic, how so? RPM's still?

The last sentence (know the choke is off from spring" along with my assumption of the top two, make me think you may have more of a Throttle kick-down issue?

I may be way off base here...


~ JR

 

[kickstart]

I'm starting to think that a new Carb may be my best move and less problems.

I've done some internet research and it looks like Weber is the best carb for the six cyl engine.

Your thoughts/comments about Weber carbs would be appreciated.

Thanks

 

[JR74CJ5]

I removed the cover and spring and put on the manual choke kit.
It still idles high until it warms up and then you can hit the gas and it will idle down.
I made a bracket and spring loaded the choke arm so it is always open unless you hold it closed with the cable.

This sounds to me like the "kick down linkage" is still working on the side of the carb. It's generally wanted so the jeep engine will warm up good. If it's malfunctioning though, and "sticking", or resetting itself while driving, I'd understand the problem.

But I'm sorry, I'm probably just missing it, but what is the problem? If it's kicking down after you rev the gas, and staying kicked down, then what is the issue?

The choke and fast idle starting system are 2 different things. And some engines are equipped with a CTO switch (3rd system) to provide additional advance during start up by supplying manifold vacuum (higher during idle, lowers during acceleration, advances distributor) until the coolant is hot enough to switch to the needed standard Ported vacuum (lower at idle and raises with acceleration)

I only mention that because if you have this, then when you start to drive before warmed up, the vac advance may not be working off the correct vac source for "driving vs warming up".

I have to remember that myself in the mornings... I start driving before the engine is fully warmed up, then wonder why its running like



~ JR

 

[kickstart]

That's what might be the problem, because it takes way too long to idle down and many kicks. I thought removing the spring and putting the manual choke kit on would solve the problem. Thanks

This sounds to me like the "kick down linkage" is still working on the side of the carb. It's generally wanted so the jeep engine will warm up good. If it's malfunctioning though, and "sticking", or resetting itself while driving, I'd understand the problem.

But I'm sorry, I'm probably just missing it, but what is the problem? If it's kicking down after you rev the gas, and staying kicked down, then what is the issue?

The choke and fast idle starting system are 2 different things. And some engines are equipped with a CTO switch (3rd system) to provide additional advance during start up by supplying manifold vacuum (higher during idle, lowers during acceleration, advances distributor) until the coolant is hot enough to switch to the needed standard Ported vacuum (lower at idle and raises with acceleration)

I only mention that because if you have this, then when you start to drive before warmed up, the vac advance may not be working off the correct vac source for "driving vs warming up".

I have to remember that myself in the mornings... I start driving before the engine is fully warmed up, then wonder why its running like



~ JR

 

[JR74CJ5]

You can try setting the adjustments for the fast idle linkage (I only know how in the MC2100 Carbs, so you'll have to search for it for the webber)

Or alternativley to test if I am right track back from the vac advance line on the distributor. If it goes into a CTO switch like this:

(Or similar) then try to run a vac line direct from the "Ported" vacuum source direct to the vac advance, and see if the jeep does better.

If it's all warmed up, does it still do this?

When it finally does kick down, does it stay that way?



~ JR

 

[kickstart]

It does Kick Down when it has run a while.
It does not have anything that looks like the item in your pic.

Thanks

You can try setting the adjustments for the fast idle linkage (I only know how in the MC2100 Carbs, so you'll have to search for it for the webber)

Or alternativley to test if I am right track back from the vac advance line on the distributor. If it goes into a CTO switch like this:

(Or similar) then try to run a vac line direct from the "Ported" vacuum source direct to the vac advance, and see if the jeep does better.

If it's all warmed up, does it still do this?

When it finally does kick down, does it stay that way?



~ JR

 

[Torxhead]

For a good choke operation, it also requires a properly operating thermostat. Like around the 195 degree type. Since you havn't mentioned that the engine is fully warmed up.

 

[Les]

When I acquired my Jeep, it had the same Weber carb in it that you are having problems with. I fought that aggravating, piece of junk for several months, until I made the decision to upgrade. What I did was install a Ford/Motorcraft 2150, 2bbl carb kit. My CJ now starts better (electric choke), runs better, has more power and I'm getting two more miles per gallon. The Motorcraft carb is also very easy to work on and I can get cheap parts anywhere.

Here is the link below on Ebay for the guy I got my kit from. The carb was new, he setup the jets for my area, included the breather and adapter plate, gave very good customer support, gave me access to tons of useful info and great directions, plus you get unlimited phone support if you need it. I was able to install the carb in about two hours and it was basically "plug and play", with little or no fabrication required. At $295, it was also a deal.

Hope this helps.......

NEW MotorCraft 2150 Jeep/AMC/Eagle/Pacer Carb Upgrade 258/4.2 1.08 Venturis | eBay

 

[kickstart]

Les, I have been thinking that the weber would make a fine target, thanks for the link to ebay.

 

[JR74CJ5]

I've got a MC2100 Carb. While Les is right they are a breeze to work on, I've even rebuilt mine on the side of the road in the snow, I'm not sure this will actually fix your problem.

I hope I'm wrong though!

I still think you have a fast idle system setting that is off, or vac issue during start up.



~ JR

 

[Les]

Based on the concerns of J.R. in his reply about your carb situation, I thought I would add a bit more detail about the problems I had with the exact same Weber carb you are dealing with. I too, had a carb that seemed to have a mind of it's own and was acting like the choke was sticking. I was having idle problems, mileage problems, plug fouling, lack of top end power and depending upon the outside temp and other factors, it was regularly going from overly rich to "hey, I smell gas" rich. I was repeatedly cleaning and adjusting the carb, changing jets, checking for vacuum line leaks, timing, bad gaskets and anything else I could think of. I was even running the recommended Holley fuel pressure regulator and at one point had it turned down to as low as 2lbs, hoping that would solve my issues, but no such luck.

What I finally found was that when the problem would show itself, I pulled the breather and shined a light down the throat on the carb and discovered it was wicking extra fuel from ongoing internal leaks and essentially simulating the choke being on. In the Winter, this was mostly an idle/hesitation problem, but once Summer arrived, the issues propagated across the entire power band. While it's nothing more than my own opinion, from working on several Weber carbs in the last few years, I believe that the carbs sold these days are not built with the quality they once were, so that's when I decided to cut my losses and install the Motorcraft carb.

Hope you get your issue solved.....

 

[kickstart]

I will give a full report as soon as I can.

Thanks for all your help and ideas.

 

[kickstart]

Semi full report-
I decided to go with the 2150 from the guy on evilbay and finally got a chance to put it on this past weekend. I went with a manual choke to keep things basic and also ordered his air cleaner kit.

I ran the jeep through the woods for several miles up down and around and a short road trip with a top speed of 65. I'm happy to report that there were not any problems and it runs fine, better than ever. So far so good

Thanks to all especially Les :ty:

 

[sjc115]

How is the cold starting performance? Do you have to let it warm up for an extended period of time before driving?