Knocking(?) noises in my CJ7

[Jebarstad]

Posting from Tapatalk as I cannot join the main forum.

I have a 1982 CJ7 . It has a AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l from an 85 (PO swapped), with a T-5 and a Dana 300 . Dana 30 and AMC20 with 4.10 gears. Tires are 29" with no lift. It's basically stock in regards to mechanical function, aside from the swap.

Shortly after I got it, the camshaft sheared teeth off the distributor gear enough that it wouldn't turn. I replaced the distributor and took it to a shop for a tune and general check-up (bought it at about 9,000ft and I live at 5,500). Oil sample showed metal, and a lot of it. I was basically told I needed a new engine. I opted to pull the engine and send it to S&J Engines in Tacoma, WA. They remanufactured the engine, to include sleeving all 6 cylinders, as they were all .060 over and out of round. Got the engine back, reinstalled, and got it running. Fast forward a few months, I performed the TeamRush ignition upgrade and replaced the failed coil. On a road trip, the Transmission seized up. PO had 80w90 in it, causing 1st gear to seize to the mainshaft. Once I got it back, I had intermittent valve "clatter", which I remedied by adding a little oil. Come to realize later on that I'm probably an idiot and have way too much oil in the engine, if that's possible. After the clatter started to get more and more frequent, it started this knocking noise when under load. I was able to duplicate it while sitting still by shifting the Transfer Case into neutral and running the Transmission through the gears. I pulled the Transmission , thinking the shop that fixed it messed something up, and had it fully disassembled and cleaned by a different shop. They said it's completely good to go, as well as the Transfer Case after taking a peek inside.

Pulling the valve cover off, there's obviously oil flowing up to the top, I just don't know if it's enough. Between crappy weather, working two jobs, and then losing my main job, it's sat for a while. The Transmission 's still out, and I can't get the engine to run on its own. I'm at a loss for what to do next, besides taking it somewhere (something I'd rather avoid). Is there anything blatantly obvious that I should check next?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuTOxLTbZNs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qAM_bT5uxBI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5YGVh-2ngg


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[dschwab]

It is hard to hear the noise you speak of but may I suggest checking the timing. I know you said you did the team rush ignition upgrade after the rebuild, and pre ignition or detonation can cause what sounds like pinging or engine clatter. I had it happen to a engine I didn't snug the distributer up all the way and it came out of time on its own. And also I am not too familiar with the upgrade you performed but I know when I upgraded my ignition I had to spread the gap on my spark plugs and change the timing from what the factory recommended to avoid pre ignition. Hope this helps and good luck.

 

[Jebarstad]

It is hard to hear the noise you speak of but may I suggest checking the timing. I know you said you did the team rush ignition upgrade after the rebuild, and pre ignition or detonation can cause what sounds like pinging or engine clatter. I had it happen to a engine I didn't snug the distributer up all the way and it came out of time on its own. And also I am not too familiar with the upgrade you performed but I know when I upgraded my ignition I had to spread the gap on my spark plugs and change the timing from what the factory recommended to avoid pre ignition. Hope this helps and good luck.

Yeah, I feel the same way about most videos. It's quite distinct in person.

The timing was good when I left on the trip. I don't know what damage the Transmission may have caused, but it didn't break down until 600 miles down the road. According to a calculator I used, my Transmission shifted into 1st at 85mph or so, which translates to a little over 13,000RPM. I disengaged the clutch very quickly, but I don't know what happened in between.

I believe I gapped them at .030.

 

[dschwab]

If your math is correct 13,000 rpm will almost surely result in some damage. My guess for the first damage to occur would be that it would valve a piston due to the lifter springs not being able to keep up. Result very well could be a bent valve. Could also be a spun main crank Bering, bent push rod the possibilities are endless with that kind of RPM.

 

[CJim7]

If your math is correct 13,000 rpm will almost surely result in some damage.

Like blowing the engine apart.....that's almost 3 times the redline of a AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l

 

[mtnwhlr]

If it indeed reved that high i'm surprised it even still runs and you don't have a rod thru the block. You can take a big screwdriver and put it to the pan and valve cover and put your ear to the handle and here where the noise is coming from.

 

[Jebarstad]

Sorry, I didn't mean to insinuate that it ACTUALLY revved that high. But that's the speed my Transmission input shaft would've been going for the moment the clutch was engaged. As soon as I heard the shift I got the clutch pedal on the floor and pulled over.


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[Lumpy Grits]

A sized tranny will bog the engine down, unless the input shaft broke.
Our CJ AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l 's, are 'redlined' at 4500 rpm.
What weight oil are you using in the engine? Who's filter??
All I think I heard was some lifter noise. Kinda normal--
Remember-These AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l 's were based off a tractor engine, and was never considered a quiet engine.
I have 116K+ miles on my 31+ year old AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l , and have never been 'inside' other than to reseal the valve cover a couple of times. I run Castrol 20W-50 and a Wix(OEM)filter.
LG

 

[Jebarstad]

A sized tranny will bog the engine down, unless the input shaft broke.

Our CJ AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l 's, are 'redlined' at 4500 rpm.

What weight oil are you using in the engine? Who's filter??

All I think I heard was some lifter noise. Kinda normal--

Remember-These AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l 's were based off a tractor engine, and was never considered a quiet engine.

I have 116K+ miles on my 31+ year old AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l , and have never been 'inside' other than to reseal the valve cover a couple of times. I run Castrol 20W-50 and a Wix(OEM)filter.

LG

The Transmission itself wasn't seized. It wouldn't shift out of first (even if the shifter was moved). I could shut it off, put it in gear, start the engine, and as soon as I started to let off the clutch I could tell it was binding, as it was in 2 gears at the same time.

I realize they redline at 4500, I threw 13,000 in there to illustrate the stress that was put on the clutch and potentially the engine.

10w30, I believe, Pennzoil High Mileage. K&N filter.

There definitely was lifter noise. I think I'm having oil flow problems. It's worse than normal though, as before the Tranny took a dump, it was much quieter.



It's hard to capture one specific noise on an iPhone in such a noisy vehicle. I've been told by two different shops that the Transmission is fine. As far as I can tell, the clutch is fine. Whatever this noise is, I don't see how it could be in the engine, if I can take the engine up to 4500rpm with the Transmission in neutral, and it sounds normal.

 

[Lumpy Grits]

Is the re-builder's warranty still in effect?
Where is the engine oil level on the dip-stick? What color is the oil?
Why are you using 'high mileage' oil? How many miles on the engine now, after the rebuild?
I would change the oil in the engine and tranny. What oil did the engine rebuilder say to use?
80w90 is a bad choice for the T-5 . AMC learn'd that 35+ years ago.
Get some of this for the tranny.
Synchromesh Manual Transmission Fluid | Pennzoil Synthetics

LG

 

[CJim7]

When you pulled the valve cover to check oil flow, did you happen to check the torque on the rocker bolts? loose rocker bolts aren't that uncommon....especially after a shop has had their hands in it.

 

[Lumpy Grits]

When you pulled the valve cover to check oil flow, did you happen to check the torque on the rocker bolts? loose rocker bolts aren't that uncommon....especially after a shop has had their hands in it.

THIS x2

LG

 

[steve1973]

X3. Above. You were going 85 mph in a CJ??


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[Lumpy Grits]

OP-Any updates?
LG