• Hello Guest, we are proud to now have our Wiki online that is completely compiled and written by our members. Feel free to browse our Jeep-CJ Wiki or click on any orange keyword when looking at posts in the forum.

Linkage help

Linkage help
J

Jslampe

Jeeper
Posts
50
Thanks
0
Location
Des Moines
Vehicle(s)
'83 CJ7 258 5pd D300
Hey folks, the pivot body bracket sheared off its own bolts (we have some seriously rough roads round here), leaving the pivot head and bellcrank disconnected. Question, if I replace the linkage, do I need to mess with the Transmission ? The linkage system and Transmission seem modular (connecting at the throwout lever), making it feel like I should be able to order a linkage kit and call it day.

Here's a diagram for more help: https://www.morris4x4center.com/jeep-clutch-linkage-parts.html

Also, any recommendations on kits? I see Crown and Quadratec have quite a few, but they might not come with installation notes. That seems suspiciously too easy. Thoughts?

FWIW: I have a haynes service manual, but can't find anything on the issue.
 
The linkage is pretty simple. No need to mess with the Transmission . You will need to adjust linkage afterwards to get the clutch adjustment correct. (this is easily done with the threaded rod portion of the linkage.
 
I'm probably ignorant, but this looks nothing like my original setup. I'm used to seeing the bellcrank, pivot, etc. leading from the clutch pedal to the Transmission via a bellcrank that runs perpendicular to the frame. How does this even connect to the Transmission ? Visually I'm struggling.

Also, what work was needed to be done with the firewall clearance you referenced?

What are the functional differences and benefits of the black betty vs. the factory?

Any tutorials or videos on installation!?

Thanks guys, as always!
 
Jslampe said:
I'm probably ignorant, but this looks nothing like my original setup. I'm used to seeing the bellcrank, pivot, etc. leading from the clutch pedal to the Transmission via a bellcrank that runs perpendicular to the frame. How does this even connect to the Transmission ? Visually I'm struggling.

Also, what work was needed to be done with the firewall clearance you referenced?

What are the functional differences and benefits of the black betty vs. the factory?

Any tutorials or videos on installation!?

Thanks guys, as always!
Click to expand...

I'm still running the factory clutch linkage, but it looks like heim joint setup still uses the stock bellcrank but connects it to the clutch pedal and shift fork with heim joints instead of pins and the crappy ball joint thing.

Black Betty is just the name of Turbogus's Jeep, but I'd also like to know the advantages to the heim joint setup
 
I know that there are those who disagree, but a hydraulic conversion is always an option. I used to have my bell crank disconnect during hard articulation. (a common problem with CJ's I have been told) Since I switched to hydraulic, not a single clutch linkage problem.
 
Jslampe said:
I'm probably ignorant, but this looks nothing like my original setup. I'm used to seeing the bellcrank, pivot, etc. leading from the clutch pedal to the Transmission via a bellcrank that runs perpendicular to the frame. How does this even connect to the Transmission ? Visually I'm struggling.

Also, what work was needed to be done with the firewall clearance you referenced?

What are the functional differences and benefits of the black betty vs. the factory?

Any tutorials or videos on installation!?

Thanks guys, as always!
Click to expand...

You really need to buy a REAL, FSM for your Jeep. Not the Haynes or Chilton.
The OEM was thanks to the AMC 'bean-counters'. The heim joint deal is what AMC should have used.
I've been run'n my home made heim joint linkage for over 25 yrs, with no issues.

LG
 
Bottom-line: I need to replace the whole linkage system. The whole thing is pretty rough and it's only $60. Will upgrade to the heim hitch in the next year or so. Thanks everyone for the input!

.... Now, if only I get the damn bolts out of the firewall... 30+ years have pretty much welded them in and I have room to create leverage to bang'em out or use an extractor. Used penetrating spray and blow torch, and still nothing.
 
That kit comes with complete instructions and once it's out of the box it becomes apparent how it goes together. The bars are heavier gauge than O.E. and on 'Black Betty' it was nesessary to hog out the hole through the firewall with a rasp to allow for clearance. Not too tough really :)
The results were a less vague feeling from the linkage and with those heavier members, gave me confidence that these are long lasting and for the last five years, so far so good. :)

I've had great results with PBlaster penetrating oil to free siezed nutz and bolts once applied give it time to work, then have at it.

X2 for the FSM, the three volume set for my '78 'Black Betty' was around $50 on EBay. That was the first jeep related purchase I made when I got her.

5367669522_026563421d_b.webp

P1040587.webp
 
Last edited:
mriplaybass said:
I know that there are those who disagree, but a hydraulic conversion is always an option. I used to have my bell crank disconnect during hard articulation. (a common problem with CJ's I have been told) Since I switched to hydraulic, not a single clutch linkage problem.
Click to expand...
Hydraulic clutch has my vote, no linkages. :)
 
I've tried the PBblaster. Nothing. I went to war on it for another 2 hours last night. I lost. Here are some pics in a google drive folder (the forum won't let me upload): https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1MU4dzoosJIl_DD7rh4JX6IY74WYhyQAN?usp=sharing

What these don't show you is how little clearance I have to do much. Can't get a bolt extractor in there. Again, I've tried penetrating spray, propane torch, hammer. Any other ideas?

IMG_20180520_144910.webp

IMG_20180520_141751.webp

IMG_20180520_144858.webp
 
It's been awhile since I did mine, and as I said earlier, I have since switched to a hydraulic clutch, but as I recall, I just used a punch and drove the broken bolts through. I don't remember if the plate that you said you are prying on is a one piece assembly, ie, the bolts and plate are all one unit, and driving the bolts out toward the inside of the cowl will loosen it. At any rate, I just replaced the sheet steel plate with a 3/16" piece of flat stock, drilled it, and then I could reach up inside, hold the bolt with a wrench, and tighten the nuts from under the hood.
Another option would be to just grind the broken bolts flush with the firewall, and drill them out. It is not necessary for the bolts to be "captive", reaching up inside with a wrench is easy.
 
Thanks for sending in those pics, I have seen that pivot break before, but that is the first time I have seen it break at the bolts. I would think you would probably have to drill them out though. That would mean replacing the busted studs with bolts and would also suggest a backing plate to hold it more ridged. From what I have seen they break due to the fact that the bell crank is not perpendicular to the frame putting most of the load against only one of the pivots. When the engine is in the correct position, the bell crank is perpendicular to the frame making the clutch linkage work just fine. But when the motor mounts sag, the engine moves to the rear. This is noticed by the valve cover getting pretty close to the firewall, the engine side of the bell crank moves to the rear also. There are also nylon bushings inside the bell crank that will wear out. They would be item #10 on your diagram.
 
Ok... Upon my reassembly of my frame off '77 I was sooooooooooooooooooo exited to finally pull my Jeep out of the garage. I put my clutch in and the sh!tty plastic bushing broke. This is the bushing on the clutch side of the linkage (I hate Crown).

Looking at the "Black Betty" set up but not sure how it works. Does anyone have pictures of it installed? I'm not afraid of throwing money at the problem, but $100 is $100.

Also, what is involved in switching to hydraulic? I've been so wrapped up in the rebuild I never gave the clutch linkage too much thought.

Thanks in advance.
 
Idahododgeram said:
Ok... Upon my reassembly of my frame off '77 I was sooooooooooooooooooo exited to finally pull my Jeep out of the garage. I put my clutch in and the sh!tty plastic bushing broke. This is the bushing on the clutch side of the linkage (I hate Crown).



Looking at the "Black Betty" set up but not sure how it works. Does anyone have pictures of it installed? I'm not afraid of throwing money at the problem, but $100 is $100.



Also, what is involved in switching to hydraulic? I've been so wrapped up in the rebuild I never gave the clutch linkage too much thought.



Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...


Are your talking about the plastic bushing in the end of the bellcrank? The heim joint linkage still uses all the bellcrank stuff. It just replaces the rod from the clutch pedal to the bellcrank and i think part of the linkage from the bell crank to the fork.

I've got the Rugged Ridge kit coming tomorrow and hope to have some pics this weekend


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Yes, the crappy plastic end on the bellcrank is my issue. I bought the Crown replacement and is is a POS. It is literally my weak link in the whole set up. I wish I could just weld the whole thing up and move on.
 
Well that sucks. I just bought a kit to replace both of mine from crown. I think I replaced the whole bell crank a while back (probably close to 10 years ago) with a crown piece and it has held up until now


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Idahododgeram said:
Ok... Upon my reassembly of my frame off '77 I was sooooooooooooooooooo exited to finally pull my Jeep out of the garage. I put my clutch in and the poopiety plastic bushing broke. This is the bushing on the clutch side of the linkage (I hate Crown).

Looking at the "Black Betty" set up but not sure how it works. Does anyone have pictures of it installed? I'm not afraid of throwing money at the problem, but $100 is $100.

Also, what is involved in switching to hydraulic? I've been so wrapped up in the rebuild I never gave the clutch linkage too much thought.

Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry you're having so much trouble with this. What with the plastic bushing failing upon install it seems that the linkage may have been binding up for some reason. If so, it wouldn't work well anyway. Detailed photos of your setup would be great as well. I've got to run to Portland today so I'll be pretty wiped out before I make it home, but I'll try to take some pics this weekend and post them in thumb nail section here.

alt_clutch_linkage.webp
 
Last edited:
The last time I bought the bushings I got them from the Jeep dealer.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Jeep-CJ Donation Drive

Help support Jeep-CJ.com by making a contribution.

Help support Jeep-CJ.com by making a contribution.
Goal
$200.00
Earned
$0.00
This donation drive ends in
0 hours, 0 minutes, 0 seconds
  0.0%
Contribute
Back
Top Bottom