Springs question

[Naiveambition]

Wandering if these are stock. Looks to me like the tie rod bar is really close.
Is this caused by the shackles being to tall?
Was bought this way so trying to fix all the bugs and make her road trail ready.

I'm just learning about jeeps , but am a long time gear head so any suggestions are welcome. Upgrades to follow

 

[Naiveambition]

Another view

 

[Naiveambition]

Here it is in all its pre fix glory. From this pic it looks really good, whoever redid this one definitely had an affinity for bondo.

The body will be replaced later on, but till then it will be ok.

 

[Naiveambition]

Pictures

 

[Petescj]

The springs look stock but its hard to tell. The shackles arent stock and seem a little tall but not terrible. A measurement will tell exactly what you have. That said it looks like the bushings are cracked on the top and worn out on the bottom along with the bolts being bent up. Did you drive it? And if so how did it track? Does it wander?

Looks like the engine , Transmission and Transfer Case all leak. Typical Cj. That spare tire will get you nowhere. Just ribbing you a bit.

 

[Naiveambition]

Yes your right about the spare, only place it's good for is a city chase on cops, good show, questionable characters and pissed relatives since the car always belongs to my mothers uncles aunt:madjeep::madjeep:

Anyways yes the shackles are 5 inches between bolt centers, I've read lightly that anymore than 2 inch is unsafe. Is tie rod spacing above spring an issue? I'm guessing it moves at the same rate, but. I have been fooled before

This jeep. Must be able to handle freeway speeds in houston, and i. Yet to see a texan miss a turn

so please chime in if you see something wrong

 

[thescot]

Anybody think its odd thats there is what looks like a bottom helper spring in the pack. Your front springs looks like a leaf pack from the rear of something else. Longer shackles are OK long as they have the welded center brace. They do reduce the departure and arrival angles as they hit things like rocks etc.

 

[IOPort51]

I would say the springs are aftermarket, just because the clamps are strange. long shackles change the camber o the wheels, cause it to not want to track at speed. the tie rod/drag link looks about right, it never really changes its distance from the spring that much through the entire flex range.

loose the shackles.

measure the distance from the top of the spring to the bottom of the bump stop. Stock is 1" so whatever you have , subtract 1" from and that is your spring lift.

 

[jdarg]

The springs look stock but its hard to tell. The shackles arent stock and seem a little tall but not terrible. A measurement will tell exactly what you have. That said it looks like the bushings are cracked on the top and worn out on the bottom along with the bolts being bent up. Did you drive it? And if so how did it track? Does it wander?

Looks like the engine , Transmission and Transfer Case all leak. Typical Cj. That spare tire will get you nowhere. Just ribbing you a bit.

They don't look stock at all. Mild lift to them for sure, the spring clamps are different, etc.

 

[Old Dog]

I would say the springs are aftermarket, just because the clamps are strange. long shackles change the camber o the wheels, cause it to not want to track at speed. the tie rod/drag link looks about right, it never really changes its distance from the spring that much through the entire flex range.

loose the shackles.

measure the distance from the top of the spring to the bottom of the bump stop. Stock is 1" so whatever you have , subtract 1" from and that is your spring lift.

I agree.
I would go to a stock length (or as close as I could get) shackles for driving down the highway in Texas.

 

[Petescj]

They don't look stock at all. Mild lift to them for sure, the spring clamps are different, etc.

I'll give you the clamp. Ive seen those used on springs that were re arched a bunch of times. I dont see the lift in them though. I was already setting up the Limited up for some work so I took a couple pics




This is a stock spring with shackles that are 5 in bolt to bolt. I dont see a difference in the arch of that spring compared to the op.



Heres a pic for you that shows the drag link and yours looks pretty much like mine. IOport is spot on cause this never really changes throughout the flex cycle.

 

[Naiveambition]

Drove it out for the first round the block drive and off road test. Was short and sweet but give an idea of condition. Plenty of power in this AMC 304 still

As for the springs, I'm thinking they were set up for off road since the springs I know we're messed with since I doubt jeep used a plumbing T fitting as a spacer for the clamps. Just don't know stock comparison . They look exactly like the rear springs. I'll have to count but all four have the helper springs.

And thanks for the pics, finally noticed my sway bar is missing, which could explain why she was all over the road today. And never got above 40
I'm sure it needs an alignment too.
Could this also be the spring setup in the front.? Shackles?

At this stage there is no way I would attempt highway driving with the way it's walking.

 

[Petescj]

This one had me out of bed early this morning. I thought I counted 5 leaves with the helper spring but Im thinking its 5 plus the helper now.

The only 76 and up Cj spring I can come up with thats has 5 leaves is indeed for the rear.

 

[Petescj]

I also ried finding after market springs that used that type of clamp. I seemed to remember seeing some awhile back. I found 1 company that uses something similar. Tuff Country they were called. Only four leaves again though. Your Jeep shouldnt be wandering like that for sure. I think its more than the shackles. Mine are the same size as yours but it sounds like Im alot more stable than you. Ive had Cjs with and without the sway bar. I never really noticed a significant amount of difference. Alot of highway driving would probably make me install one though. Heres something for you to look over:


http://www.jeep-cj.com/forums/f99/troubleshooting-correcting-your-steering-4106/

 

[Naiveambition]

Petescj thank you much for your replays there are helpin me a bunch.

Ok the measurements are in

Front.
6 springs plus helper spring so total of 7
2 inches wide springs with 3.5 inches between axle and bump stop

Rear

6 springs plus helper spring with total of 7
2.5 inch wide springs with 4.5 inches between axle and bump stop.

Well now I've been to college and they sayz I'm educatered, . But this has me at a loss. I'm thinking their is a lift with bad bushings and other than stock springs. In the rear a friend thinks the rear axle hangers were relocated forward, partly to rig the spring and to make the strecth over the rust hole. All this will be fixed of course, but wander If they are springs from a wagoneer or some sort. The look heavy duty to me.

So as you stated their is more at play, but at least I'm not relying on my own knowledge to keep working out the issue. Thax to all who replied extremely helpful. For. Us newbs

 

[Petescj]

Great my eyes are terrible then.

More bad news for you. Even if they were Cj springs from that era the only configurations they came in were 4 , 5 and 7 leaves. And thats rear springs only. Fronts were just 4. Aftermarket can have more. Can you get any number off these springs? Maybe off the top of the top leaf?

 

[jdarg]

I think the springs are academic at this point. Get back to stock shackles - that will help a fair bit. I would probably leave the springs along if they are otherwise good unless you really feel the need to change height.

If its constantly changing directions 40+ MPH its not the lack of sway bar at all and adding one won't change it at all. Probably play in the steering - check all joints - steering column, shaft, gear box, TREs, make sure your ball joints are good and the front hubs aren't loose, etc.

My CJ5 was the same way when I got it. Fine up to about 35-40 then it was a white knuckle experience if you dared go any faster, esp. on a bumpy road. Everything except a couple TREs and the bell joint were bad so I replaced it all and now it drives like a normal vehicle again. I'd have no reservations driving on the interstate @ 70mph in it now.