Dauntless V6 opinions

[abcdefg]

I am in the market for a Jeep (this will be my first) and have more or less decided on a CJ5 of one vintage or another. A nice CJ2a or 3A would score a lot of cool points too but it looks like a decent CJ5 will be easier to find. I don't care for the tall look of the 3B or the long wheelbase of the CJ7 , so it gets to be a matter of which CJ5 . My first question in the weeding out process involves the Dauntless Buick 225 V6 . The Dauntless Buick 225 V6 , from what I've read, was the predecessor to the 231 Buick (that's 3.8L, or 3800 to you kids), which, initially anyway, was absolute junk. They did eventually turn it into a decent engine, but the first ones were right up there with the all aluminum Vega and the 350 olds diesel. So what about the Dauntless Buick 225 V6 , good engine, or as bad as the (also odd firing) one it spawned?

 

[Hedgehog]

The Dauntless Buick 225 V6 is a much loved engine. While the odd fire does make a few scratch their heads when installing a distributor there is nothing wrong with the odd fire engine. I installed a Buick 231 in my '80 CJ5 and wish I had that jeep back again. The V6 produces big torque right off idle, perfect for a 4 wheeling CJ, in many ways a real powerhouse in a small package.

 

[hagar]

X2 for the V6.

 

[tarry99]

I am in the market for a Jeep (this will be my first) and have more or less decided on a CJ5 of one vintage or another. A nice CJ2a or 3A would score a lot of cool points too but it looks like a decent CJ5 will be easier to find. I don't care for the tall look of the 3B or the long wheelbase of the CJ7 , so it gets to be a matter of which CJ5 . My first question in the weeding out process involves the Dauntless Buick 225 V6 . The Dauntless Buick 225 V6 , from what I've read, was the predecessor to the 231 Buick (that's 3.8L, or 3800 to you kids), which, initially anyway, was absolute junk. They did eventually turn it into a decent engine, but the first ones were right up there with the all aluminum Vega and the 350 olds diesel. So what about the Dauntless Buick 225 V6 , good engine, or as bad as the (also odd firing) one it spawned?

Allot to be said about the old 225 Dauntless Buick 225 V6 Odd fire Dauntless Buick 225 V6 engines. And they are not the same as the later FW 3800 models. Some good things and some not so good things........Had my share of Dauntless Buick 225 V6 's in the past in fact still have 2 Odd fire's here , one a rebuilt Kenne-Bell motor and the other an OEM AMC 70's factory crate short-block replacement motor still in the box. I also have one Even fired ex-turbo motor here that I'm building that has Skat rods and Crank along with ported heads and Ferrea Stainless valves......This one when finished would have had port injection.........

The Bad: Poor oiling system , from the antiquated oil pump and front cover to the oil gally passages into the rocker shafts and rocker arms........takes allot of work to correct that stuff.........Decent Power but the high Torque rating is not true torque in the known mechanical since.........with the use of a heavy 55 lb flywheel they have what most folks consider to be Inertia induced Torque..........

From a magazine article I wrote years ago: THE HEAVY FLYWHEEL CANNOT "ADD TORQUE" PER SE AS THE ENGINE DOES WHEN IT CREATES POWER. IT CAN ONLY ADD INERTIA AS IT SPINS AND IS THEN LOADED. THE APPLICATION OF THE LOAD TO THE SPINNING MASS USES THAT INERTIA TO INCREASE TORQUE MOMENTARILY. AFTER THAT KINETIC ENERGY IS ABSORBED ONLY THE TORQUE OF THE ENGINE IS NOW AVAILABLE. AT THAT MOMENT, THE EXTRA MASS OF A HEAVY FLYWHEEL BECOMES A LIABILITY TO THE ENGINE'S TORQUE OUTPUT TO ACCELERATE IT ONCE AGAIN.

Basically you have to accelerate the mass in order to use it which has it's own price & penalty to pay.......Off Road On a trail at low speeds with low gear ratio's the heavy mass is a Plus as it keeps the motor running while pulling along the mass of the drive train at near Idle.

The initial reason for Buick engineers to use the heavy flywheel was to carry the engine between and through the Odd Fire sequence of 90 and a AMC 150 degrees of timing.

Trying to accelerate that engine from a dead stop or while trying to pass at freeway speeds is another subject.........Years back I compromised that issue by getting a 30 lb flywheel made.......with 4.88's in the back and Overdrive the lighter flywheel allowed the engine to accelerate and still run at low speeds........best of both Worlds.

I think the even fire 3.8 motor would even respond better to the lighter flywheel without the Odd fire timing handicap and heavy flywheel penalty.

Parts for the Odd fires are becoming harder to find.........Pistons kits are still out there but if you hurt a crank beyond .030 undersized your SOL on parts.........Standard sized Odd fired cranks are non existent as well as some other parts unless you go aftermarket from folks like T.A. Performance in Arizona.........Nice motor does a decent job........Just my Opinion!

 

[duffer]

Yep, a few quirks here and there. That said, it's probably still the best factory engine put in any CJ. Relatively light and makes really decent power, especially with a few modest aftermarket additions. It is light years ahead of the other option at that time: the F 134.

Personally, I like it, but you have to weigh that against a few other things AMC did post 71: Saginaw steering, sort of real brakes, and a lot more beef in the T-15 Transmission .

 

[abcdefg]

Since I started this thread I have not been able to get back on the forum, finally gave up and reregistered. Hoping for better luck this time.

Been shopping while you were responding and was considering a 69 with the Buick motor, it was tempting and the price wasn't bad, but a few too many iffy mods for me. I settled on a 76 CJ5 with a AMC 304 /4speed. Seems to be good mechanically and the frame is very nice except for a little rust all the way in the back left corner by the spring shackle. The tub is pretty rough, but I can deal with that. It's been off the road for almost 20 years so It'll get a good looking at, new fluids and such before I try to use it for anything. After that I'm not sure, one piece axles, disc brakes, tires, lockers....who knows.

 

[Hedgehog]

4 speed .... T-18 .... VERY cool!

 

[abcdefg]

OP here, under my third name. If I log off this time and can't get back on again, I'm done. Doesn't seem to be a way to contact an administrator, email function is turned off, it says. Too bad, looks like it could be a really good forum.

 

[Hedgehog]

Your problem appears to be very common and nobody seems to be either willing or able to fix it. Many of us have found it to be troubling to have new folks come in here just to get frustrated and quit. New blood keeps a forum going, without it we are just talking to ourselves. Try contacting "Elwood" he seems to be proactive on the subject lately.

 

[abcdefg]

Your problem appears to be very common and nobody seems to be either willing or able to fix it. Many of us have found it to be troubling to have new folks come in here just to get frustrated and quit. New blood keeps a forum going, without it we are just talking to ourselves. Try contacting "Elwood" he seems to be proactive on the subject lately.

Thanks, I'll try that. I sent a PM to CJ and have kept this tab open hoping to get a response, if I go away I'm pretty sure I wont be able to get back on.

Just being able to read through the old posts has been very helpful, but now that I have a jeep I am sure I will have specific questions that I would like to be able to bring up. I'll keep my fingers crossed.