"EXPEDITION' Vs. 'OFF ROAD'...

[TeamRush]

'Off Road' can be just that, a Dedicated 'Off Roader',
A Part Time 'Off Roader',

Usually fairly close to Civilization, and usually in a 'Group' of Off Roaders, or someplace 'Off Roaders' gather so you aren't completely stranded...

----------

For me, 'EXPEDITION' vehicles need to have a LOT more attention to detail,
Tougher parts, trail repair 'Spares',
Tools to do that work,

And an 'Expedition' vehicle will often times be alone, so things like Self Rescue are important.

--------------------

Now, since I plug around in the river bottoms WAY out in the 'Boonies' by myself,
If I want or need 'Help' it's often 10 miles or more to get help,
And there is no way a 'Tow Truck' can get to me.

To that end, I build more like an 'Expedition' vehicle than an 'Off Roader'...

Self Rescue.
1. Dual, Fully Isolated Batteries.

I used to mount a second alternator, or lug one around with me 'Just In Case'.
My 'Welder' was my second, but converting an alternator that will do serious welding is too large to fit in the 'Normal' alternator position on my V-8,
And lugging around a second alternator was a pain in the butt.

I've found out I can pack the alternator full of mud, and still run an entire weekend on Dual Batteries.

Dual batteries are fully isolated, combine with a 'Self Rescue' switch on the dash, and combine automatically when the oil pressure comes up.

2. Dual Starter Relays.
Since I needed a second Starter Relay anyway for dual batteries,
I feed both batteries directly to the starter when I hit the key.
No getting out to 'Self Jump'...

It's a simple matter to disconnect either battery in the event a battery fails... Which I'll cover below...

3. Dual Fans.
I kept the Mechanical Radiator Fan, Using a type with large blades that flatten out when I hit deep water so they don't eat the radiator,
And I installed a large Electric 'Pusher' fan in front of the radiator in case a fan belt breaks or I loose a blade and have to take the fan off the engine.

Dual water pump drive belts keep the water pump turning, so I don't have to worry about that.

4. Dual Fuel Pumps.
With VERY LITTLE valving, I'm running a mounted Electric fuel pump along with the Mechanical fuel pump.
I use the electric pump when the Mechanical pump gives up, or to draw fuel from cans, transfer fuel from tank when I need it.

5. Dual Ignitions.
My vehicles had VERY UN-RELIABLE ignition systems,
So I built a dual trigger distributor, run two ignition modules, two coils.
With the flip of a switch I can transfer from one ignition to the other without the engine missing a cylinder...

6. On Board Air.
I didn't want the brackets and stuff that went with a engine mounted compressor (My CJ's didn't come with compressors),
So I use a Viair electric compressor and some pretty large storage tanks,
One mounted under the body, One in the bed for a 'Lend Air' situation.
With the bed tank hooked up, I'm over 10 gallons of tank capacity, so this works well and compensates for the lower volume electric compressor.

On Board Air makes airing up and down tires a snap, but I also use it for tools and to pressurize my distributor, axles, Transmission & Transfer Case when I'm in deep water.
An air pressure regulator makes your system several times more useful.

7. On Board Welder.
Since I often have to do small welding jobs on the Jeep, as well as around the farm in the middle of nowhere, being able to weld from the Jeep is a great thing!
I use to carry a big old Alternator converted to weld from,
But now I mostly weld from the vehicle batteries, which makes things MUCH more simple and a lot less to drag around.

8. 'Lend A Battery' or 'Lend Power'.
Being able to pull a battery and stick it something else, or to use it around camp, lend battery/jumper cables to someone else makes for a really useful 'Upgrade'.

9. Winch.
A LARGE WINCH will take a lot of 'Battery',
So I use two batteries, which do most winching jobs quite well.
Since I already have two batteries for 'Self Rescue' and 'Lend' power,
It's a no brainier to use Heavy Relays to keep them isolated until I need them for winching.

10. Tools & Spare Parts.
The more things you can make your tools do, the better off you will be.
In an emergency, I will sacrifice my wrenches or jack handle to make parts, or to weld in 'Patches' to get me home.
One end flattened out makes a pretty good pry bar,
A socket extension welded to the side makes for a VERY long 'Breaker Bar'...

Having extra 'U Joints'/Straps, Fuel Rated hose (my air line), some extra hose clamps, and a small selection of parts has always allowed me to get back in without a tow.
Nothing like wacking off a piece of your air line to use as fuel line! Double Duty!

Jumper Cables made from welding cable make double duty for Jumps and Welding,

And lets not forget tow straps, clevises and the stuff you need for the winch...

I'm NOT trying to sell this as a 'HOME GAME', just trying to decide if this qualifies as an 'Expedition' Vehicle or an over equipped 'Off-Roader'...

 

[hole]

"I'm NOT trying to sell this as a 'HOME GAME', just trying to decide if this qualifies as an 'Expedition' Vehicle or an over equipped 'Off-Roader'..."
__________________


I'd call you well equipped. Glad to see you back sir

 

[TeamRush]

1. Dual Batteries.

There are several 'Evolution' to Dual Batteries I went though,
The first was just to sock an extra battery in there and go to town,
But even how the cables hooked up to the batteries was a big issue,
Believe that or not!

I first ran Positive to Positive, Negative to Negative and had the cables coming off the same battery to the starter.
The battery in the 'Back' of the cables always died first and always seemed 'Low' so after a little research, I found out how to wire the batteries to get BOTH fully charged,

This arrangement charges and discharges the batteries at the same rate,
When wired this way, the charging system sees them as ONE LARGE battery instead of two smaller ones.

-------------------------------------------------

After having BOTH batteries run down together a couple of times,
(Kids playing in the Jeep leaving things turned on, and me forgetting and leaving the key switch on once)

I decided to 'ISOLATE' the second battery when the engine wasn't running.
To do that, the Isolation Relay needed to know when the engine was running, and when it wasn't.

The key switch wasn't any good, if I wired it to the ignition, any time the key switch was 'ON' the batteries would be tied together, and BOTH would run down.
The SOLUTION was an oil pressure switch. No oil pressure, second battery isolated...

BUT!
I put the isolation relay in the WRONG PLACE!

First off, the Isolation Relay was a serious restriction to electrical current when I needed it.
Secondly, when it failed, I didn't know about it, so the second battery was dead when I needed it most.

-----------------------------------------------

The third try got BOTH batteries to the starter, and was COMPLETELY REDUNDANT.
Simply by moving the second Relay, I had BOTH batteries turning the starter.

But this created a 'Chairing Issue' which I solved with a common relay from the parts store.
Since charge amperage is low, I didn't need a full size starter relay to get things charging...

Now, I had FULL CURRENT to the starter from both batteries,
Both batteries charged when the oil pressure was up,
And both batteries helped out with the vehicle electrical demands when the oil pressure was up.

The batteries Isolated completely when the engine stopped working.

------------------------------------------------

When prices for scrap went up, batteries started disappearing all over the farms out here in the boonies.
That's when I came up with 'Lend Power', a quick disconnect battery I could pull for farm equipment, generators, ect. and put back in the Jeep just as quickly.

It's also a VERY good way to pull a battery for camp use or to 'Lend Power' to a project via Jumper Cables that match the battery connector.

------------------------------------------------

My first winch required heavier cables, and a way to Isolate the second battery, but still deliver it to the winch when needed.
So I came up with this...

When the relay between batteries failed, that left me winching with ONE battery, which was no good.
The larger the winch, the sooner that single relay will fail...
(ask me how I know that... )

---------------------------------------------------

The final evolution of this process was a LARGE winch,
The ability to STICK WELD or SPOOL GUN WELD off the batteries,
Have them fully isolated, but still be able to combine them when I needed power for the winch or to self rescue...

The 'Digital Cocktail Napkin' version of what I came up with...

Now, a 'Drawing' is a long way from actually building anything...

 

[TeamRush]

DUAL FULLY ISOLATED BATTERIES, WINCH, WELD, LEND POWER, ECT.

NOTHING PROPRIETARY, ALL THE 'CONSUMABLE' STUFF IS FROM ANY PARTS STORE IN AMERICA.

First off, 'Discount Store' Relays vs. Good Copper Terminal Relays...
Copper terminals will give you more than twice as much current passage,
And they don't 'Weld Shut' on you during hard use...
The Copper Buss bar is what the relays are sitting on...

Rough Assembly & Trial Fitting,

Heavy Cable Terminals in place for fitting,
And if you need 'Copper' washers, they cost 1¢ each!
Pre '82 Pennies are 97% copper, so they work great.

The final product, with some Heat Shrink Tubing to help insulate some of the copper buss, and out for testing!

It's a pretty ugly on the fender, but I was going to make darn sure it worked while I could still get at it to change things!

I'll wind up hiding it under the Dual Battery Tray when I clean up the wiring this spring, so it's not going to live it's entire life on the top of the fender!

 

[TeamRush]

Now, For Welding off the batteries, you need to be able to wire the batteries in Series for 24 volts,

That means having the batteries on 'QUICK CONNECTORS' called 'Anderson' connectors show in the diagrams above.

This is the welding 'Yoke' that very quickly combines the batteries in 'Series' for 24 volt welding current.

This is the 'Lend Power' battery Quick Connect...
One yank and the cables are free, The connector will pass 350 amps minimum, and when combined with the second battery, plenty for welding, jump starting, camp use, ect.

-----------------------------

Anderson Connectors are also handy for things like Jumper Cables without raising the hood and messing with trying to get clamps to bite on your battery terminals,

This bumper mount connector also powers up my 110 volt inverter,
Jumper Cables, and it's where I plug in the snow plow hydraulics when the plow is mounted.

----------------------------

When you make your 'Jumper/Welding' cables, make one lead shorter than the other.
Helps keep the clamps from touching each other when they are 'Hot'.

'LEND POWER', to camp site, someone broken down, Jump Start something you don't want to drive your vehicle to, ect.

Low Dollar Rod Clamp for welding,
I use copper blocks in the jaws for higher Amperages/larger rods...

 

[TeamRush]

ON BOARD AIR.

I started with a small Viair Compressor.
Running back and forth to fill up that 'Travel Tank' got old in a hurry,
So a small compressor seemed like a natural choice.

Since at the time, I had a VERY large alternator mounted for welding and such, putting another bracket on the engine for a 'York' compressors wasn't an option,
And I didn't want to mess with the brackets, belts, ect.

From Compressor to Distribution Block.
Some people would call it a 'Manifold'...
This is set up to deliver full tank pressure, regardless of what the regulator is set up for...

From Distribution block to the regulator.
The choice of spots for the regulator was easy, close to the distributor since I wanted to pressurize my distributor to keep water out when 'Swimming' the little Jeep...

Some caps for the air chucks, they get packed full of mud pretty easily...
Chair Leg Protectors makes good cheap caps!

This is a diagram of the basic air system,
Now there is a tank under the Jeep, and the axles, Transmission and Transfer Case are all pressurized with a Solenoid Valve so I don't have to get out and open a manual valve anymore.

 

[TeamRush]

DUAL FANS.

Notice the radiator Spaced Back towards the engine in this picture?
That's to clearance the electric fan between grill shell and radiator.

I'll add more about that fan and it's mounts later.

 

[TeamRush]

DUAL IGNITIONS.

Let's face it, Jeep has poor choice in Ignitions.
It's about the #1 complaint I have to deal with...

My Jeep came with a worn out breaker point distributor and I won't run breaker points on anything I can covert!

I used Chrysler Triggers in my conversion, simple, easy, cheap, strong and ACCURATE.

Since I was going to be making a LOT more spark energy, I needed to get it to the plugs...
A blow through proof rotor on the Delco distributor and good distributor cap were in order...
Notice the replaceable rotor nose held in by a screw instead of a rivet?
There are extra rotor blades in the bottom of the distributor, just in case!

To fit the larger 'Ford' style distributor cap, I used MSD 'Cap-A-Dapt' collar to adapt the 'Ford' cap to the distributor.
In a pinch, I can get a 'Ford V-8' cap at any parts store or junk yard...
Since it's not a 'Wear' piece, I only had to buy it ONCE.

The 'Ford' distributor cap for V-8 engines comes with a vent in the top, and that's a water leak point,
But to turn it to my advantage, I use it to pressurize the cap with air, now the distributor blows bubbles under water while running happily along...

Notice that REPLACEABLE center terminal in the cap? There is an extra one of those in the bottom of the distributor also. Rotor blade and center terminal are about all that can go wring with the High Voltage side of this ignition that isn't Doubled up...

That's a MIG welder tip used for a air hose nipple, screws right into the cap, works as a restriction so you don't over pressurize the cap and blow it loose from the distributor.

Completed Delco Breaker Points to Dual Chrysler Trigger Distributor.
Notice the TWO trigger wire pairs coming out the bottom?

-------------------------------------

Dual Triggers also go into the 'Jeep/Motorcraft' distributors pretty easily,
But you HEI guys are out of luck...

------------------------------------

Now, for two coils...

The black gadget you see on top of the coils is the coil 'Selector', it's from MSD, and it's a one time purchase...

Switch from one ignition to the other is as simple as flipping a switch on the dash...

One thing this comes in REALLY handy for is hauling heavy loads or lugging the out of the engine...
You can offset one trigger slightly to reduce ignition timing when hauling heavy loads, have cheap gas, ect.
Then switch to the fully advanced ignition when you have better gas or aren't lugging around the 'Titanic' on a trailer...

 

[TeamRush]

WINTER means snow and slush in a lot of the US.
Spring means 'Monsoon Season' for us in the 'Rust Belt'!

I got REALLY TIRED of always having to repack my wheel bearings after every run, and lots of the time, I found water in my differentials/axles right after just servicing them!

It's always nice to see $30 worth of Synthetic Gear Lube and a fresh gasket get scrapped because the lubricant looks like a rancid milkshake after one weekend wheeling! :brickwall

Anytime you splash a hot hub or differential housing, transmission, transfer case, ect. off into cold water, the metal will contract and distort.
That leaves gaps where water can get in.

Then the air inside cools and contracts, sucking in water though those gaps in the gaskets/seals...
The result is a nasty 'Milk Shake' effect, and a BUNCH of work to clean, lubricate and seal things up again.

SO, Check above to find out how to keep the water out of your axles, transmission, transfer case with air pressure...
Nothing like an On Board Air Source and a regulator to keep the 'Nasties' out of your drive train!
-------------------------

HUBS CAN'T BE PRESSURIZED.
But, where grease is, moisture can't be!

I'm going to cover getting the axles ready for that air pressure,
and how to UPGRADE & repack the front wheel hubs/spindles so you don't have water in them all the time!

WARNING:
If you don't do a lot of 'WET WORK' in your Jeep, this is a waste of time and money.
Mall Crawlers, Street Jeeps and Desert guys wouldn't need this...
............................................................

Step One,
Would be to get a spindle nut socket. 2-1/16", Thin Wall.
Available from EVERY Jeep parts supplier in the free world for $6 to $50, with the average being around $8 to $10.

This is the ONLY specialty piece of equipment you will need.
Everything else will be available commonly, or you can 'Borrow/Rent' it at the local parts store.
...............................

STEP TWO, Jacks and JACK STANDS!
Don't even think about working on hubs/axles without Jack Stands!
...............................

Step Three,
Clean work surface. I don't care if you get a piece of plywood, a $6 Foam 'Sleeping Mat', or a clean spot on the garage/driveway floor, but you MUST have a clean work surface for this!

Doesn't hurt to cover that surface with paper towels so you don't get everything greasy.

A little tray for small parts is a good idea, I use magnetic trays for small parts and they work great, or you can just hack off a gallon jug and toss a magnet in it for the small stuff.
You don't have to be fancy, just handy!
...............................

Step Four,
Remove Wheel & Tire.
Remove brake caliper. Wire it up, DO NOT let the caliper dangle by the hose!
(Your FSM or Repair manual will show how to do this)

Remove lockout switch or center cap if you have drive flanges.
(There are so many kinds of lockouts I can't begin to tell you how to take the cap/switch off the lockout)

Remove 'Snap Ring' from end of stub axle.

Remove lockout body or drive flange, this is normally a 9/16" bolt heads.

1/4" Punch and Hammer.
Punch back large washer edge (separation/lock washer) so you can remove outer spindle nut (specialty socket required).

Spindle & Hub, Exploded View.

Remove Large Washer.
Remove Inside Spindle Nut.
Remove Small Spindle Washer.

Hub Rotor should pull straight off.
Be mindful of the outside bearing, with the inside spindle nut removed, it's loose in the hub.
Once it clears the spindle, it can fall out of the hub, be sure to catch it.

Once the hub/rotor is off, you can pull the inside hub seal, and remove the inside bearing for cleaning/Inspection.

Clean out the hub THROUGHLY so you can see what is going on inside.

You will notice there are 'Notches' on the inside of the hub, These are for driving out the bearing 'Cup' or 'Race'.

Hub, Showing Clean 'Notch',

What I do is drill into these 'Notches' with a 1/8" drill bit so I can inject grease directly into the hub and full the air spaces so water can't invade when I splash through water.
This is a DECEPTIVELY SIMPLE IDEA, and farm equipment have had these grease fittings for years.
Only seemed right that my little 'Tractor' get some too!

Hub, Pilot Hole Drilled and Marked,

MAKE SURE YOU PICK A SPOT THE LUG STUD ISN'T GOING TO INTERFERE WITH THE GREASE GUN!

Once the 1/8" pilot hole is bored, you simply back bore the outside of the hole for about 1/4" deep for threading or pushing the grease Zerk in.
(Zerk is a brand name for the little nipple/valve that accepts grease)

There are two basic types of grease Zerks, Push in and threaded in.
I prefer threaded type so when they break off, the 'Stump' is easier to get out...

This is a 'Grease Zerk Wrench' and it's available at any of the better parts stores, farm equipment stores, tool stores, ect.
The pointed end is an 'Easy Out' for removing broken off Zerks,
The other 'Arm' is a threading/thread cleaning tap,
The two socket ends are for straight fittings and 45 or 90 fittings.

Zerk Wrench,

This is a Great Tool to have for all of your grease fittings, from Ball Studs, to Universal Joints, to Suspension Bushings, Tie Rod Ends, ect.

Once the outside 1/4" deep back bore in the pilot hole is done with a #5 drill and can be threaded with the Grease Zerk Wrench or a 1/4"x 26 TPI NF Tap.

The common small grease Zerks are 1/4"x 26 TPI NF,
(TPI: Threads Per Inch, NF: National Fine)
And that is NOT your average fine thread...

Then just screw in your Zerk, Mark it's location so you remember to face it DOWN when changing wheels, and that's all there is to it!

From now on, you can fill the hub cavity up completely with grease, eliminating air pressure changes and water infiltration completely!
----------------------------------------------------

NOW! ON TO THE SPINDLE!

Since you have the hub off, you should probably do the spindle too so water doesn't invade your lockouts via the stub axle channel.
Good time to check/replace your spindle bearing and it's seals!

Spindle Graphic,

What you will need...
9/16" socket and drive tool,
Spindle puller.

Once the spindle is off, you can do this upgrade to fill the spindle air spaces completely up with grease, eliminating air pressure changes with temprature, and excluding all moisture!

This is VERY easy, it's simply drilling a hole in the spindle and using a 'Grease Needle' to fill the spindle channel once the spindle is installed on the stub axle...

I use a 1/8" Drill and locate the hole just behind the inside wheel bearing.
I usually align the hole with the slot in the spindle for easy finding when things get greasy!

Locating The Hole,

Then, you use a 'Grease Needle' to fill the air gap between stud axle and spindle...
I use a metal one intended for chain saw blade tip lubrication.

Grease Needle,

You simply press the needle into the hole, and pump until the grease exits around the axle inside of the spindle!
Rotate the axle by hand a few times, and make sure the void is full with a few more pumps, and you are done!

Needle In Spindle

-------------------------------

This upgrade is VERY EASY, requires nothing more than the tools you already use to change wheel bearings/spindle bearings, and it's a REAL BEARING SAVER for those of you that like to splash through the mud and water!

Tools-Parts.
1/8" drill.
#5 drill.
2 small Zerk fittings.
1/4" X 26 NF tap.
Cutting oil.
Hand drill.
Optional,
Fitting wrench for small fittings.
Paint marker.

 

[TeamRush]

WHERE GREASE IS, WATER AND CRUD CAN NOT BE.

The same goes for electrical connectors, Dielectric Grease is the best invention behind sliced bread and Duct Tape!

I find it's not the Primary Drive Train that gives up,
It's the small stuff...

Batteries,
Alternators,
Fans/Fan Clutches,
Fuel Pumps,
Ignition Components,
Wheel Bearings,
U Joints,

It's very rare that I run into someone with a cooked clutch, rod thrown out the block, broken Transmission or Transfer Case , axle gear set...

It's usually a wheel bearing giving up in the back and the axle creeping out the tube,
A front wheel bearing giving up,
An ignition module that quit working,
A fuel pump that gave up,
Broken belt on a single belt water pump,
Leaking water pump, now the engine is over heated (5 Gallon Can of water on the back for that particular issue)

By making the wheel bearings more resistant to crud, They live longer and work better.
By doubling up on what you can for reasonable money, you become 'Redundant' and you don't get stuck...

 

[TeamRush]

Working on something, got the wrong post up here but I'll replace it with information about the build...

 

[Razorfish]

Hi. I really like your tips. Thanks for them.

One thought I'd like to add. I'm a data center architect/engineer. I both design and do day-to-day support of thousands of servers for high profile customers. Bottom line is these servers can not go down ever so redundancy is very important. Recently there's been several trade articals on how too much redundancy actually makes redundancy worse. i.e. 2 powers supplies is good, but 4 would make things worse. It's all about statistics but the simple version is, there's always a chance one of your power supplies can go bad and take out the remaining power supplies. This is a very small chance and having dual power is statistically better, but as you add power supplies it comes to a point where the risk starts to overrun the benefit.

Anyway, the general rule is to have only 1 redundant part connected to any system. No problem having spares in your kit.

I don't have all the answers and my comments are just to get us thinking.

 

[Razorfish]

Oh and what are your thoughts on oxygen/acetylene welders?

 

[Old Dog]

since it's you, I'll say well equiped "off roader"
Welcome back, hope you hang around awhile this time.

 

[IOPort51]

:ww:TR, glad to have you back,

 

[TeamRush]

Oh and what are your thoughts on oxygen/acetylene welders?

I'm not a 'Gas' welder, so I have none.
I'm a LOUSY welder, so stick welding burns through the rust, mud, crud and gets the job done. (Dirt Farmer Welding)

I did build an Alternator Welder that would Stick, TIG, MIG,
Also does AC welding, and High Frequency AC for aluminum welding (TIG),
But who wants to drag around a gas bottle in a Jeep for clean TIG/MIG?

Also seemed like every time I dragged it out and set it up, the wind would blow my shielding gas away and the welds looked like anyway...

The farm guys like it (some of them CAN weld) but I got tired of lugging around all that and went to 'Emergency' welding off the batteries.
A LOT LESS STUFF TO PACK AROUND!

Now it's the welding yoke, jumper cables, hood, gloves, rods and I'm off to the races. All fits under the passenger seat, so I'm good with that...

 

[BusaDave9]

Excellent thread.
Thanks for the info.

 

[coldair]

Thanks a ton!! alot of good info.

 

[TeamRush]

I've got 'How To' threads on most of this, if you need them, I'll post them...
Otherwise, they just take up server space...

 

[Incommando]

I would like to see them... I wonder if that hub trick would work with a D60F?