Frame coating

[Rippin]

I'm trying to decide powder coat, por15, or just good ol rustoleum. Whichever way I go it'll be getting sandblasted, so prep will be top notch. And don't consider price, I'm more interested in opinions on durability.

The jeep will be about 50/50 road and woods, so I want a coating that'll hold up to the abuse of forest roads. Anyone have input?


Sent from my LG-LG730 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Kane]

I have POR15 on my CJ5 frame for ten years and it still is keeping rust at bay. I just did 3 caots of POR15 and 3 coats of POr15 chassis black on my Scrambler build. I like it. Plus I can gricnd it away, weld and then touch it back up if needed. Powder coating is not so easy that way and you are not getting the inside of the frame. I coated my inside as well.

 

[thiswontbetooexpensive]

I sandblased and painted mine with the rustoleum route. I think that will be easier to touch up as days go by. ALL of the rust on my frame was inside, I used the Eastwood product with the hose on the end for painting inside the frame. It is a rust convertor/paint that performed flawlessly for me. (Look starting at post #62 in this link: http://www.jeep-cj.com/forums/f98/1980-cj5-resto-mod-16603/index7.html)

It worked well and came highly recommended.

 

[dagr8tim]

What about hot dipping gal? I know it's harder to grind off to fix, but how does it compare to protection?

 

[PaRenegade]

My frame was shot so I got a new TDK bare metal frame. I choose to do Eastwood's Internal Frame Paint on the inside, 2 coats. Then the outside got 2 coats of POR15 and a topcoat of POR's BlackCote.

 

[thiswontbetooexpensive]

What about hot dipping gal? I know it's harder to grind off to fix, but how does it compare to protection?

IF you get the metal clean enough to make the galvanize stick, this is the ultimate way to go I would think. One thing to note is that the galvanize does not conduct electricity. ALL grounds have to be run to the battery via buss of some sort.

I like what PA Renegade has said; clean the frame and paint it up well inside and out. If the frame is shot, get another and properly protect it before you even get going on it. After spending the Mon-Thur of this week in Williamsport, everything I saw was covered in rust regardless of age!!!
If you keep the O2 away, the rust will never show up, thats what paint/galvanize/powder coat/under coat does.

 Fe2+ + O2 → 4 Fe3+ + 2 O2−

 

[jdarg]

ALL grounds have to be run to the battery via buss of some sort.

This shouldn't be the case as long as the frame is either tapped for the screw/bolt, or toothed washers are used on the connection.

Now if you put a bolt through a hole that isn't tapped, nut it on the other side, and don't use any toothed washers on that connection, you are likely to have an issue. But that's true of a non-galvanized frame too.

 

[Torxhead]

And steel is a lousy conductor of electricity, over very short spans it seems to be o.k. though.

 

[thiswontbetooexpensive]

This shouldn't be the case as long as the frame is either tapped for the screw/bolt, or toothed washers are used on the connection.

Now if you put a bolt through a hole that isn't tapped, nut it on the other side, and don't use any toothed washers on that connection, you are likely to have an issue. But that's true of a non-galvanized frame too.

Once you cut through the galvanize, you have just lost the integrity of your coating. I made off-road amphibious vehicles for a few years for a company called Rolligon. We made 6 of our small units for ExxonMobil to take to western Africa in a country called Gabon; rainforest. We had to completely manufacture the vehicles, then take all the parts off and send them to the place to be hot dip galvanized. We left bolts welded to the frame to get good grounds for stuff. Left a nut on the bolt for galvanizing, then took it off when it got back for assembly. One came back for work the other day, a friend that works there said the only problem is the bolts have started to rust where the nuts were run up and down.

Long story long, whatever you coat it with, don't break the seal or it will start to rust! Paint is a lot easier to touch up than galvanize and powder coat...

 

[PaRenegade]

And steel is a lousy conductor of electricity, over very short spans it seems to be o.k. though.

For this reason, I took and welded a s.s 3/8" bolt to my bare frame back by the rear wheel well before I painted it. I'll then run an 8 ga. wire from the battery back to it for a grounding post. Up front on the fender Ill put a copper bolt / post for all the ground cables up there. That way I have the body and frame metal PLUS a copper wire to direct battery ground.

 

[73CJ]

One thing to note is that the galvanize does not conduct electricity. ALL grounds have to be run to the battery via buss of some sort.

What? Not a metal?.

To quote Wikipedia:


"Galvanization (or galvanisation) is the process of applying a protective zinc coating to steel or iron, in order to prevent rusting. The term is derived from the name of Italian scientist Luigi Galvani. Although galvanization can be done with electrochemical and electrodeposition processes, the most common method in current use is hot-dip galvanization, in which steel parts are submerged in a bath of molten zinc. In industry, the term GI stands for galvanized iron, referring to a common galvanized steel used in many applications such as air ducts and trash cans."

"This article is about the metallic element. For other uses, see Zinc.

General properties
Name, symbol, number zinc, Zn, 30
Element category transition metal
alternatively considered a post-transition metal
Group, period, block 12, 4, d
Standard atomic weight 65.38(2)
Electrical resistivity (20 °C) 59.0 nΩ·m

Zinc, in commerce also spelter, is a metallic chemical element; it has the symbol Zn and atomic number 30. It is the first element of group 12 of the periodic table. Zinc is, in some respects, chemically similar to magnesium, because its ion is of similar size."

 

[CJ]

73, it was never stated that gal was not metal, it as a compound does not conduct. Not sure about that though...

 

[Rippin]

Thanks for the great input guys. I think paint will be the way to go. It'll definitely see it's fair share of abuse from 4 wheeler trails and limerock roads so the easy repair of the paint seems the best idea

Sent from my LG-LG730 using Tapatalk 2

 

[73CJ]

By definition

Again quoted from Wikipedia

"A metal (from Greek "μέταλλον" – métallon, "mine, quarry, metal"[1][2]) is an element, compound, or alloy that is a good conductor of both electricity and heat. Metals are usually shiny, malleable and ductile"

It is not a compound but zinc.

Hot galvanizing is cool. If I ever pull mine completely down again, it's on the list.

 

[thiswontbetooexpensive]

By definition

Again quoted from Wikipedia

"A metal (from Greek "μέταλλον" – métallon, "mine, quarry, metal"[1][2]) is an element, compound, or alloy that is a good conductor of both electricity and heat. Metals are usually shiny, malleable and ductile"

It is not a compound but zinc.

Hot galvanizing is cool. If I ever pull mine completely down again, it's on the list.

If it conducts electricity so well, get you a piece of galvanized steel and weld on it. If you get a bead to run on thick, properly applied hot dipped galvanized steel; you will have invented a new method for the world to see!

I am not doubting that you have looked at Wikipedia, or that this is a good method for protecting the frame from the elements; but it is a poor conductor of electricity. Ground your stuff. If you run a self taping screw or use a star washer, you have proved my point that the metal underneath is conducting electricity.

I know a thing or two about corrosion. You need a cathode (O2) anode (a Jeep CJ frame in this case) and an electrolyte (water in atmosphore makes a good one). If one of these is missing, corrosion will not occur. This is what the coating is for, keep water off of the metal allowing oxygen to get to the metal and iron oxide to form.

 

[73CJ]

Welding on galvanized steel is done every day.

Welding of galvanized steel is done almost exactly the same way as welding of the bare steel of the same composition; the same welding processes, volts, amps, travel speed, etc. can be used with little modification when the switch is made from uncoated steel to galvanized steel -- unless the zinc coating is unusually thick.
The difference between welding galvanized steel and welding uncoated steel is a result of the low vaporization temperature of the zinc coating. Zinc melts at about 900 ̊F and vaporizes at about 1650 ̊F. Since steel melts at approximately 2,750 ̊F and the welding arc temperature is 15,000 to 20,000 ̊F, the zinc that is near the weld does not stand a chance -- it's vaporized! By the time the weld pool freezes, the zinc is gone. This has two immediate consequences:
• The vaporized zinc increases the volume of welding smoke and fumes.
• The zinc at and near any welds is actually burned off by the heat of the arc, removing the protective zinc coating.

Hum and my pasture electic fence wire is galvanized.

Any way a galvanized frame would be cool!

 

[thiswontbetooexpensive]

Any way a galvanized frame would be cool!

I think we found something we can agree on through all this!

 

[dagr8tim]

I'm considering a TDK frame and one of the options through quadratec is to get it hot dipped. I think that would the the ultimate in protection. But have the same pitfalls as powder coating.

Plus there's the weight and the problem of having to weld or grind. Plus gal gives off toxic gases when you heat it. So welding would require cleaning up with a wire wheel first.

 

[GatorBate]

Any good ideas on how to clean out and painting the inside of a boxed frame?

 

[thiswontbetooexpensive]

Internal Frame Coating w/Spray Nozzle | Eastwood

Works great once you pressure wash all the dirt out!