Setting Up To Make Custom Wiring Harnesses...

[TeamRush]

Though I'd give up on the '' on the intenet, one size fits NOTHING stuff, and try to do a custom harness when I fixed my 'Issues' in the '73 first, the '79 later...

These are my thoughts, offer up any alternative theories or ideas...

1.There has been 40 years of connector evoloution since AMC cranked out the base wiring harness for these Jeeps, and the 'Replacmets' not only don't fit, but are just as INADIQUATE as the factory harnesses were.


2. MODULAR HARNESS!
Newer cars have them, break a connection, plug in the HID headlight harness with relays already installed,
Break the harness and plug in the Trailer wiring without having to run around and do stupid things,
Tracking wiring, splicing into wiring, never getting it to seal back up, ect.

3. Dedicated grounds, 'Weather Pack' water/crud/salt proof connectors,
Self protected wiring bundles, no more of that loose wire with a 25-40 year old wiring loom decaying around it...

4. A fuse block that actually gets enough current out to the accessories to work properly and has enough circuits to supply about everything on it's own fuse or breaker.

5. Circuit breakers for the stuff you can't afford to go down on you...

6. No more 16 & 18 Ga. wiring to high current load devices.
Everything bumps up at least two wires sizes, with the exception of dash lights and low voltage sensors...

7. Terminals for factory lights that are actually on the wires, no more having to cut and strip, use a cheap terminal to crimp on an under size wire to begin with, ect.
There is nothing I can do about the connectors that Jeep used in some places, the park lights and tail lights for instance,
But the harness should have PRE-TERMINATED wiring with replaceable sections when they turn to ...

8. I've ordered in about 16 colors of 18 and 16 Ga. wire for dash lights, gauges, ect.
I've got 10 colors of 10 & 12 Ga. wire already here,
And I've ordered about 2,500 of the CORRECT terminals to revamp that bulkhead connector and most of the 'Packard' terminals used in the Jeep.

9. I've found a headlight switch and connector that directly replaces the factory connector, so you can use your Jeep bezels on the lights, instead of a generic 'Nut' on the dash...

There is no reason the harness shouldn't FIT the vehicle, especially that under dash wiring tangle that is a nightmare for so many people...

10. Conversion harnesses...
There is no reason in the world you should be able to order in an HID (H-4) headlight harness that plugs directly into the vehicle harness...
Same with trailer lights.
Same with a GM steering column since the Jeep columns are getting scarce, and there are MILLIONS of GM columns out there just begging to be transplanted! A short adapter pigtail is all that should be required instead of having to rewire the entire under dash...

11. Gauge cluster with the CORRECT electrical electrical terminals...
The basket case in my Jeep from previous owners (POs) is what prompted me to start this, and it got COMPLETELY out of hand!
No reason why a 'Standard' harness with year specific gauge cluster pig tails and PERMANENT water/corrosion proof connectors shouldn't be available...

12. SEALED, WATER PROOF RELAYS are all over the place in GM vehicles, and we are still dealing with '60-'70s relays that get corrosion issues like crazy...
You will be able to buy them off the shelf at ANY auto parts store when you need replacements...
Same with tail light connectors, no reason why we can't have a 'Chevy' type connector in the rear for the tail light harness so you can plug in one of a 100 different makes of trailer wiring harnesses...

 

[IOPort51]

My .2
Whoever put the fuse block under the dash should be shot with a dull bullet.:shooterut it some place you can see it and service it.
I looked at several "Salvage" power center/fuze/relay blocks and found nothing acceptable. the wiring was all too small and even though the connectors could be removed I never found replacements that could be re wired. Have you found a suitable power distribution center?

The other issue is documentation, A good wiring diagram with color codes is a joy forever. The closer to the original the better. I do not want to be remembered as the dumb @^$*^& PO who butchered the wiring. I am very impressed with the 11X17 laminated color diagrams.

So those are my two biggest points with any custom wiring harness, access and documentation.

Please tell me more about your water resistant relays.

 

[TeamRush]

I've been looking at a Marine application power center, 18 slots, places for relays, all enclosed, but not completely water proof...

I'm using relays from a Cadillac,
If they are good enough for Cadillac, they are good enough for me.
Not those low amperage 'Mini' relays, but full size automotive relays with weather pack skirts that seal up.

'89 Cad, passenger side, just below the fender lip in the engine bay.
I have an application/year and I have a source for the sockets,
Bracket would be the issue...

In the event you have a relay failure, a standard 4 or 5 pin relay will fit in the socket to get you home, just won't be water tight...

 

[rr41mag]

It won't be as hard as you think. Wiring is not that bad. You will appreciate it more when you are done. If you do have a problem you will know exactly where to check for it. Good job!

 

[IOPort51]

I looked at those relays after reading a "junk yard genius" link and they are excellent relays. The problem I had was getting the gauge wire I needed in the plug. I could remove the terminal but not find replacements for them. To be honest, dismantling them was a PITA.
I would like to find a water resistant distribution center with two flasher circuits, room for 6 relays and 10 fuses/breakers.
this is what I have now for lights, fan aux lights and whatever. the only high amp circuit under the dash is the heater motor.
Now, if I could find a box to put it in I would be much happier with it.

I am using Weather proof connectors from keep it clean wiring. They are easy to attach, will use up to a 14 ga wire and are pretty much water tight. And not god awful expensive.

 

[MN CJ7]

I've been looking at a Marine application power center, 18 slots, places for relays, all enclosed, but not completely water proof....

Thanks for trying to make the harness better. There was a young lady getting wire harness help a wk ago on JeepForum or Here Jeep-CJ.com and there was a great link for the OLD STYLE CONNECTORs. I tried to copy into a WORD document and would not copy over well..... I thought I kept the link but cannot find... did a quick look and did not find the thread. Had some nice terminal info on the matrix complete with pics..... Good ref is some sees the tread maybe put link here.

The nicest dist centers I have seen are from Blue Sea.... they are not water tight but have splash covers.. They also have some larger fuse/amp dist products and some nice stuff for us... Here is a 12 circuit
version... they have smaller ones too.... and may have a larger one if you call them. Prices in past were also very reasonable.

ST Blade Fuse Blocks - PN - Blue Sea Systems

I looked at those relays after reading a "junk yard genius" link and they are excellent relays. The problem I had was getting the gauge wire I needed in the plug. I could remove the terminal but not find replacements for them. To be honest, dismantling them was a PITA.
I would like to find a water resistant distribution center with two flasher circuits, room for 6 relays and 10 fuses/breakers.
this is what I have now for lights, fan aux lights and whatever. the only high amp circuit under the dash is the heater motor.
Now, if I could find a box to put it in I would be much happier with it.

I am using Weather proof connectors from keep it clean wiring. They are easy to attach, will use up to a 14 ga wire and are pretty much water tight. And not god awful expensive.

TeamRush is junk yard genius and its his web site....

I also have 3 clusters / banks of the GM caddy and large buick relay banks. They often have a plastic shoud and plastic splash cover. I took the cover and all. The plastic cover willmount on the fender wall or the firewall. I have not done this but will when I do my electrical options, of radiator electric fans, relays to stock head lamps, relays for aux lighting, relay for rear lamp, compressor relay, oil pressure control of relay to turn off/on like fuel pump, electric choke, electric heater, etc.

Relays produce heat when activated...... Heat Kills a coil or relay..... so maybe putting in a box may not be the best idea. Maybe that is why GM used the weather proof connectors on the bottom so the top could still be air cooled. Just a thought but... most likely pretty much correct.

If looking for an enclosure.....
Search ....... NEMA 4 Enclosure..... or.... NEMA 4x Enclosure.
Should show lots of enclosures that could be used to mount your plate mounted electrical. They come in plastic and metal. Made to be outside in the rain. seal the box for the most part and the bottom can be open somewhat for JEEP APPLICATIONS....... say this because like a glass in water..... push it in the water and air pocket formes in the Nema Box and water will not fill the box.

 

[IOPort51]

"TeamRush is junk yard genius and its his web site...."

http://www.jeep-cj.com/forums/f49/setting-up-make-custom-wiring-harnesses-13311/#ixzz1pIZUnExY

I am aware of this.

I looked at the NEMA boxes and did not find the dimension I was looking for not deep enough for the relay wiring. This will more than likely become a fab project but a few things on the list before it. It needs to be on the passenger side to move away from the exhaust but space is scarce over there.

It just occurred to me that the world needs a GM relay connector made by keep it clean. It would be water tight, stackable, and wired as needed.
​

 

[IOPort51]

TR
just went back and reread your post. You mention the 89 caddy relays and say you have a source for the plugs. Can you tell us who the source is?
Are these un wired/assembled plugs?

 

[IOPort51]

I thought about deleting the previous but will stand here in wet socks instead. to answer my own question.

Home » Shop » Relays / Fuses » GM / Delphi Sealed Metri-Pack ( Metripack ) 630 High Current Sealed Relay Kit SPDT 40 AMP

I think the un sealed Bosh relay and plug were about $15 ea. so these are quite cost effective.

 

[TeamRush]

I'm VERY capable of doing the wiring,
But NOT being a snob, I'm also VERY AWARE that everyone out there has their own ideas and ways of doing things,
And they 'Educate' me every day...

Some are 'Stupid' ideas,
(the guys that use vinyl coated coat hangers for primary wire...
Zip ties his battery cable to the exhaust manifold to "Keep it out of the way"...
You know the type...)

Some are just flat GREAT IDEAS and I'm glad they share!
I've been doing this for YEARS, but I know a good idea when I see it!
(Or should I say, "I know a good idea when I STEAL it!" )

I got mine from PCS (Performance Connector Systems) off the web, and they DO NOT take the 'Weather Pack' seals on the bottom like some of the Delphi sockets do.
I've got some on order from other places also to see what their versions are like...

Even if I decide to sell these harnesses when I'm done, I'll still post up the diagrams, parts lists, sources, ect. since I'm NOT a snob and I don't have a thing in the world to hide...

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IF YOU ARE CONSIDERING A SWITCH TO H2 or H4 HEADLIGHTS...
One thing I CAN tell you right away!

STAY AWAY FROM POLYCARBONATE FRONT LENSES!
Stick to something that has actual GLASS on the front!

I spent a bunch of money on polycarbonate lenses when I converted my FSJ over, and they were 'Sanded', Scratched STUPID, in two years.

Truck Lite (Makes all those sealed quick change bulbs for big trucks) has a glass lens for about $40 each, and they have held up the last 5 or 6 years just like the original headlights do...
Worth the extra money for glass lenses if you off road or daily drive...

Don't be a "ME"...
I tried to save $10 a light, and screwed myself in the long run!
$60 for Poly, $80 for glass, I wound up loosing the $60 and still having to pay the $80 to get headlights that you could see down the road with!

-----------------------------------------

Now, with a normal 'Packard' type terminal, you push the terminal in from the back of the connection, so the barb on the terminal faces backwards,

With these connectors, the terminal pushes into the connector from the mating side, so the barb on the connector faces forwards,
So when you get these, don't forget terminals.

I also picked up the locks that secure the relay to the socket since the lock tab is on the weather pack relays when I get them, Why not for a few cents apiece...

These should do REALLY well for what I'm wanting, I'll just have to remember to plug the extra wire hole in the socket so moisture can't enter the socket from the bottom when I use them.

With this expainding 'Rubber' stuff on the bottoms instead of the regular weather pack seals, I should be able to worm two wires in there going out to the headlights or off road lights instead of just a single wire that has to jump from one terminal to another...

Again, two wires in the same hole will mean I'll have to remember a little sealer, but that's no big deal either.
Should make for a really well sealed, virtually water tight arrangement...
And the sockets are set up to take some reasonable size wire, so the headlights, ect. won't be starved for current like they are now.

Running the primary headlight wire off the fuse block 10 Ga. feed was a stupid idea from the factory,
Running the headlight power into the cab, then back to the headlights was a bad idea, and way too small amount of current reaches the H2 or H4 head lights when you upgrade.
WAY too much wire on way to small a gauge for maximum operation...

This should fix the 'Issue' and keep the wiring/sockets from burning up at the headlights...

--------------------------

I've come up with what I think is a different approach to wiring the lights to the factory switches (headlight/dimmer/factory wiring) so I'm hoping this works out...
If it doesn't burn my Jeep down, I'll post it up!

 

[IOPort51]

these look like the 40 amp relay sockets which, in the illustrations I have looked at, appear to have a different pin and pin arrangement than the Bosh 5 pin relay and/or the 30 amp relay socket. is this the case?? The 40amp would be very preferable to the 30s but it is a cool thing to be able to use a bosh relay for a spare.

 

[TeamRush]

I think what you are taking about is a Weather Pack 260 relay,
has 3 pins along one side, then two pins on the other side...
(Configuration C used mostly in the C 280 QC relays)
Most of the Series Config. C type are 20/30 amp, too small of a terminal for 40 amps, so I don't use them for fans, compressors, stuff like that, and I'm looking for interchangeability with the rest of my relays.

Or are you talking micro relays like what are used in the newer 'Power Centers' (Fuses and Relays in one box)?
Most of the 'Micro' relays are 10 amp or 10/20, and that's not even enough for headlights...
That's the problem I'm having with finding a power center, they all want to use those tiny relays for everything, and we don't drive tiny load Jeeps!
Over-built or die! in a Jeep!
No sense in trading something inadequate for something else inadequate!

--------

I'm using the 'Configuration B1' type relays and sockets,
'Configuration B' would fit right in there with no issues to get you home in a pinch, but I'm trying to keep all the relays the same, and the Configuration C relays don't cost anymore, come in Weather pack with lock,
And you can walk into any parts store in the country and get a replacement to get you home.

I'm sticking with Hella heavy relays with my stuff for interchangeability.
Light relays will swap with fan relays or air compressor relays, stuff like that.
This stuff is available, dirt cheap and stand alone, you don't have to change your fuse block to use it and still won't have a bunch of stray relays hanging out of the harness like AMC did things.

I can get home without accessory driving lights, I can't get home without a fan working!
Interchangeability is a good thing!
Hella 30/40 amp relays are pretty handy to have, they work well, they pass more than the rated current, they come ready to mount so they aren't hanging around or zip tied to the harness somewhere,

But the biggest reason I use them is they work the first time, every time without question, and they are 'Factory' quality instead of a 'Made In China' unit you are never quite sure of...

I've had a 70 Amp Hella in my charging system splitter for about 6 years,
Countless mud, water, ect. and it's never once offered to fail.

I put this together to keep things straight for me, and to teach others,
It might help folks trying to keep up with what we are talking about here...
Sometimes my brain sucks a fart and I have to look things up to keep them straight, too many part numbers and applications swirling around the drain in there at times,
Plus I have all the I've seen/heard to sort out when I'm trying to get through something...

I'd like to have double 87s for the headlight applications, but that won't happen.
Hella stopped making the heavy relays with dual 87 outputs in '91 and they have worked their way though the system... No one has them in any quantity...

And the replacements don't have the water proof skirts (Configuration B2), just plain relays.

I don't want to use anything I can't get off the shelf at the parts stores in an emergency...

 

[IOPort51]

I think what you are taking about is a Weather Pack 260 relay,
has 3 pins along one side, then two pins on the other side...
(Configuration C used mostly in the C 280 QC relays)

Read more: http://www.jeep-cj.com/forums/f49/s...ing-harnesses-13311/index2.html#ixzz1ph3JBLUT


you are right, glad I didn't order that.

Any thoughts on a through the firewall connector for switch to relay wiring and of course one circuit for the heater and one for the dash lights and the radios.
​

 

[IOPort51]

Painless Wiring 40130 - Painless Performance Weatherproof Bulkhead Connector Kits - Overview - SummitRacing.com

I guess this would work but it seems a bit steep in price.

this would be a good place for something recycled.

 

[IOPort51]

Specializing in automotive interconnect and wiring systems

or this for 1/3 the price.

 

[TeamRush]

Configuration A isn't used very much, and about all the relays you will find in anything from the early 70's up will be Config. B something.

Config. B anything is a higher power relay,
Most A relays are 20 or 30, while Bs are 30/40, depending on if it's Normally Open (NO) or Normally Closed (NC)


GM got REAL fond of the Config. C with the micro relays for headlights, ect.
Just another way to make things lighter duty...
I'm not looking for 'Lighter Duty'.

Most headlights will only draw about 10 Amps, even the H2/H4 lights,
But if someone connects a couple of off road lights, that jumps up to 20 Amps or more real fast... So I want to be ready for that, and I'm including an off road light option in the harness as 'Standard' since it's so prevalent.

I could go all Config. C with the relays, but that would let an option for an electric fan out.
An electric fan in an off roader with a 20 amp relay is a bad idea.
You can exceed 20 amps at full start up on the motor(s) so starting off with a 20 amp relay is a bad idea.
(ask me how I know that! Yup, burned 20 amp relays in my fan circuit every time it got into water... )

So I'll start off with a 40 in the first place, and after 40 amps, the breaker should save your fan motor and relay...

Finding a 5 or 6 pin weather pack connector that will fit though the stock grill holes is a challenge,
I've ordered in a couple of different types, but I might have to go with two each smaller connectors to get them to go though the stock holes.
That means an 'Idiot Proof' connector so they can't be hooked up backwards...

And there is a question of park/turn light wires also...
I think I have that one figured out, but I'll have to put one together to be sure.

 

[Turbogus]

An alternative for those of us that like to 'roll our own' I've used Mouser Electronics for even odd OE connectors (the OE male/female connector for the backup lights for instance) and other such, what's more they sell by the each!

connector Automotive Connectors | Mouser