Sloppy Steering and a ton of road wander

[hotcars]

I bought this 1980 Jeep CJ5 from a gentleman who's father had just passed away and the Jeep was his father's Jeep. He knew nothing about it and it had been sitting for 10+ years and wasn't running. I got it going and it runs great! This Jeep has 69,427 original miles and original Jeep top and Original paint.

It had 30X9.5 15 tires on it and was very sloppy trying to steer it down the road. (seemed worse at lower speeds) I recently installed a 2.5 inch Procomp lift kit and 33" Maxxis tires on 10" wide steel wheels. The sloppy steering actually feels better but today I was driving it at highway speed (65 mph) and it almost got away from me. It was all over the road and at one point I thought it was over, pretty scary!

My question is-
What is a good replacement Steering box that will preform good at highway speeds with the 33" tires?

Thanks in advance,
Hotcars

 

[CJim7]

I bought this 1980 Jeep CJ5 from a gentleman who's father had just passed away and the Jeep was his father's Jeep. He knew nothing about it and it had been sitting for 10+ years and wasn't running. I got it going and it runs great! This Jeep has 69,427 original miles and original Jeep top and Original paint.

It had 30X9.5 15 tires on it and was very sloppy trying to steer it down the road. (seemed worse at lower speeds) I recently installed a 2.5 inch Procomp lift kit and 33" Maxxis tires on 10" wide steel wheels. The sloppy steering actually feels better but today I was driving it at highway speed (65 mph) and it almost got away from me. It was all over the road and at one point I thought it was over, pretty scary!

My question is-
What is a good replacement Steering box that will preform good at highway speeds with the 33" tires?

Thanks in advance,
Hotcars

Before you pull the trigger on a new steering box, you need to eliminate the easy (and probably more likely) problems first.

Check your tie rod ends on both the tie rod and the steering linkage for play. Check all your suspension bushings. Check to see if the steering box is loose. Axle U-bolts. Then onto the wheel bearings, and ball joints. Bad ball joints cause a lot of bad steering experience. To check them, jack up one side of the vehicle and push on the top part of the tire. If the tire has a wobble affect, it's ball joints. That's the easiest way I can describe it.

A good thing to do is get a buddy to move your steering wheel back and forth while you look at the front end. This is a good way to spot unwanted movement between the steering box, tie rod ends, bushings, suspension components...

Remember, any movement is bad movement. Expect your suspension bushings to give some, but excessive movement means they are worn out enough to cause problems.

Have you had a toe alignment done?

 

[hotcars]

No, has not had an alignment yet.
I know the axle u bolts are tight because I just installed the lift myself. Also, I did not notice any loose or worn components when doing the lift. I will check everything you mentioned but if all seems reasonably OK what is a good steering box for highway use?
The AGR SB1 states "steering box is not recommended for short wheel base vehicles at highway speeds" and the AGR2 states "better for highway use" but will it be sufficient for a short wheel base Jeep even though that is what they are made for?

 

[CJim7]

Having not run the AGR boxes, I cant comment. But after looking at their site, the SB2 seems to be the better move.

The OME Saginaw box is also sufficient, but it sounds like you want to upgrade. Fair enough

One other thing to check on your current settup...after you have eliminated all the other things I mentioned. The steering box is adjustable and the access is through the crossmember just above it. It's tricky to adjust them as you can over-adjust and cause tight steering or even damage to the box. But it is a last resort.

 

[hotcars]

I figure if I am going to replace the gear box I might as well upgrade.
As far as adjustment, I tried that and it helped a little bit at lower speeds but today it was really all over the place at 65 MPH. It's weird though because it was driving fine for a few miles and out of the blue it started drifting and over correcting quickly so I let off the gas and it came back then drove fine for a few more miles and did it again. I drove off highway roads to get back home and it steered great but did get a little loose a couple of times at the lower speeds but the lower speeds are manageable. At 65 MPH it gets scary.

 

[fzsk4p]

I figure if I am going to replace the gear box I might as well upgrade.
As far as adjustment, I tried that and it helped a little bit at lower speeds but today it was really all over the place at 65 MPH. It's weird though because it was driving fine for a few miles and out of the blue it started drifting and over correcting quickly so I let off the gas and it came back then drove fine for a few more miles and did it again. I drove off highway roads to get back home and it steered great but did get a little loose a couple of times at the lower speeds but the lower speeds are manageable. At 65 MPH it gets scary.

Still do what Jim said before throwing $$ at is.

If you are going to do an upgrade then PSC is what you want. Hard to beat the quality and service Tom and his group provides.

PSC Motorsports

 

[ftwflh]

My Jeep was a nightmare when I got it.
First thing I found was a totally shot steering shaft and bushing(where the shat hooks to the column)these helped a bunch.then came tie rod ends and wheel bearings.Got even better.then had the front end checked for alignment and had to gt caster blocks for the front axle to get the caster to come into specs.Now it drive as good as can be expected from a lifted short wheel base.

What I am saying is start with the cheaper easy stuff that is wore out.

 

[mylittlecj5]

A question for you...Have you ever owned a CJ before?
I ask because they are like no other automobile on the planet. THey have handling quirks that might lead an inexperienced person into thinking there is something wrong when there isn't.
That said, you have to make sure everything is perfect on your CJ in regards to steering, or you get into the conditions you describe.

And i agree 100% with fzsk4p, the PSC boxes are great! I have a PSC variable ratio box on mine and I am very impressed with how my CJ handles compared to the stock box. It is the same box that Jeep used in some of the full size J-10 trucks.
I got my PSC box from this vendor on Pirate4x4...PSC Steering - LetzRoll - Pirate4x4.Com Bulletin Board

 

[fzsk4p]

A question for you...Have you ever owned a CJ before?
I ask because they are like no other automobile on the planet. THey have handling quirks that might lead an inexperienced person into thinking there is something wrong when there isn't.
That said, you have to make sure everything is perfect on your CJ in regards to steering, or you get into the conditions you describe.

And i agree 100% with fzsk4p, the PSC boxes are great! I have a PSC variable ratio box on mine and I am very impressed with how my CJ handles compared to the stock box. It is the same box that Jeep used in some of the full size J-10 trucks.
I got my PSC box from this vendor on Pirate4x4...PSC Steering - LetzRoll - Pirate4x4.Com Bulletin Board

Andrew does have great CS and prices !! Thanks for bringing him up as a vendor mylittlecj5. I had totally forgot about him.

He has a wide assortment of parts from top name companies.

 

[ken98k]

At 65 MPH it gets scary.

I'm no expert but 65 mph in a CJ5 is pushing the safety envelope.
Like MYLITTLECJ5 said "they are like no other automobile on the planet."

 

[CJim7]

I figure if I am going to replace the gear box I might as well upgrade.
As far as adjustment, I tried that and it helped a little bit at lower speeds but today it was really all over the place at 65 MPH. It's weird though because it was driving fine for a few miles and out of the blue it started drifting and over correcting quickly so I let off the gas and it came back then drove fine for a few more miles and did it again. I drove off highway roads to get back home and it steered great but did get a little loose a couple of times at the lower speeds but the lower speeds are manageable. At 65 MPH it gets scary.

This sounds exactly like ball joints.

 

[hotcars]

I'm no expert but 65 mph in a CJ5 is pushing the safety envelope.
Like MYLITTLECJ5 said "they are like no other automobile on the planet."

If I can't drive 65 MPH in my Jeep there is no sense in owning it.
I want it for light wheeling and trails. I am not trailering it to off road sights so I need to drive it there at highway speeds. There are too many other 4x4's that will drive safely at highway speeds if the CJ can't get there.

Thanks

 

[hotcars]

A question for you...Have you ever owned a CJ before?
I ask because they are like no other automobile on the planet. THey have handling quirks that might lead an inexperienced person into thinking there is something wrong when there isn't.
That said, you have to make sure everything is perfect on your CJ in regards to steering, or you get into the conditions you describe.

And i agree 100% with fzsk4p, the PSC boxes are great! I have a PSC variable ratio box on mine and I am very impressed with how my CJ handles compared to the stock box. It is the same box that Jeep used in some of the full size J-10 trucks.
I got my PSC box from this vendor on Pirate4x4...PSC Steering - LetzRoll - Pirate4x4.Com Bulletin Board

Nope, never owned a Jeep CJ or any other 4x4 for that matter but I am a car guy and have owned well over 50 american classics, hot rods, and muscle cars. I have owned everything from Mini's to a 10 second Barracuda so I know my way around mechanics and I have seen a lot of unusual things.
Yeah, I should do all of the less expensive stuff first but from my experience it feel like a steering box issue. Like I mentioned to CJim7, I will check out all of the steering components along with wheel bearings and alignment.

Thanks for the input

Read more: http://www.jeep-cj.com/forums/f19/sloppy-steering-ton-road-wander-7788/index2.html#ixzz1Buxc9w7h

 

[fzsk4p]

Nope, never owned a Jeep CJ or any other 4x4 for that matter but I am a car guy and have owned well over 50 american classics, hot rods, and muscle cars. I have owned everything from Mini's to a 10 second Barracuda so I know my way around mechanics and I have seen a lot of unusual things.
Yeah, I should do all of the less expensive stuff first but from my experience it feel like a steering box issue. Like I mentioned to CJim7, I will check out all of the steering components along with wheel bearings and alignment.

Thanks for the input

Read more: http://www.jeep-cj.com/forums/f19/sloppy-steering-ton-road-wander-7788/index2.html#ixzz1Buxc9w7h

OK, with your experience then you should understand how a vehicle like a CJ would handle at highway speeds. Combine the shortwheel base, high COG and narrow track. What do you think an acceptable highway speed should be ?

 

[ken98k]

If I can't drive 65 MPH in my Jeep there is no sense in owning it.
I want it for light wheeling and trails. I am not trailering it to off road sights so I need to drive it there at highway speeds. There are too many other 4x4's that will drive safely at highway speeds if the CJ can't get there.

Thanks

I never owned a CJ7 but suspect they may handle better at highway speeds than a CJ5 .

I do own a 90 yj (Wrangler) which handles much better than my CJ5 on the highway, though it does take a while to reach 65 with its 2.5 liter motor.
I’m certain that un-altered tj’s and jk’s go very well on the highway because I get passed by them frequently.

The myth that CJ5 ’s were unsafe has its origins in the way many people drove them, like a conventional automobile, which they were never intended to be.

 

[hotcars]

OK, with your experience then you should understand how a vehicle like a CJ would handle at highway speeds. Combine the shortwheel base, high COG and narrow track. What do you think an acceptable highway speed should be ?

Acceptable highway speed for me would be a speed that didn't get me ran over by other traffic. I am in N. California and if you are not driving 70-75 MPH you are slowing up traffic. (not talking about commute traffic which doesn't move at all). I would be happy to travel at 65 MPH.

 

[hotcars]

I never owned a CJ7 but suspect they may handle better at highway speeds than a CJ5 .

I do own a 90 yj (Wrangler) which handles much better than my CJ5 on the highway, though it does take a while to reach 65 with its 2.5 liter motor.
I’m certain that un-altered tj’s and jk’s go very well on the highway because I get passed by them frequently.

The myth that CJ5 ’s were unsafe has its origins in the way many people drove them, like a conventional automobile, which they were never intended to be.

Maybe I should just sell it and stick to the real cars that are intended to drive, not vehicles that were intended to be off road only which makes the jeep useless for 95% of people

 

[BigAl77cj5]

As far as highway speeds go in a CJ5 I have pushed mine to the limit. I out ran a dodge cummins in it one night. had to be going at least 95 mph. Also when I was a kid my dad had a 79 CJ5 as his daily driver it was a 6cyl 3spd. I can remember us going down the highway (90)as fast as she'd go multiple times. but with loose steering that would be pretty scary and don't know that I would want to try it in one that is lifted.

 

[hotcars]

As far as highway speeds go in a CJ5 I have pushed mine to the limit. I out ran a dodge cummins in it one night. had to be going at least 95 mph. Also when I was a kid my dad had a 79 CJ5 as his daily driver it was a 6cyl 3spd. I can remember us going down the highway (90)as fast as she'd go multiple times. but with loose steering that would be pretty scary and don't know that I would want to try it in one that is lifted.

One of the reasons I only lifted it 2.5 inches is because I didn't want the problems that go along with high lift jeeps. I understand the high COG and the short wheel base but 2.5 inches is not that much and you would think the larger 33" tires would make it drive better because of how much more tire meets the ground and the larger tires actually did help it drive better, I think??? at least when it is driving and steering like it shouild. I think the bigger tires made it worse once it starts the wander because they are so much bigger than the 30" tires it had on it.

I really don't know. I do know that after I go through the whole front end and relace all nessecary parts that if it doesn't drive good at highway speeds it will be someone elses cause I will sell it. I see no reason to own an unsafe vehicle.

Thanks and take care

 

[hole]

I hope you're able to correct your problem, CJ's are in a handling class of their own. I recently experienced some random highway speed "road rage" with my 8. Turned out to be the ball joints in my case, replacing them made a night and day difference.