Welding options
DIG
Jeeper
So which is the best to weld with on our jeeps? stick or mig? I am also going to be teaching myself in the process so I guess which is easier to learn also? Thanks
Welding options
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CJ
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There is no real 'best'. It's what your most comfortable using. If you are just starting out I would definitely say Mig as it is the easiest to use and they are getting cheaper and cheaper by the day. A mig feeds the wire as well as shields the weld with a gas, making less things you have to keep track of as your learning.
DIG
Jeeper
thats kind of what I was leaning towards...any reccommended model or anything? surely it cant be that hard to weld, well its probably a pain in the 
CJ
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The recommended model really depends on how much you want to budget. The harborfreight one is a great starter mig (from what I have heard) and I'm very partial to Miller.
LOL - 'surely it cant be that hard to weld, well its probably a pain in the' - that is the beauty of welding, it is actually not very difficult - it just takes LOTS of practice to be come proficient. Many people can 'make things stick together' but to actually do a decent weld just takes practice. Did I mention that welding takes practice? I think I did...
The best thing I ever did was sign up for a quick course at the local tech school (years ago), I was taught the correct way the first time, I didn't have to fight my way out or through all the wrong things.
LOL - 'surely it cant be that hard to weld, well its probably a pain in the
' - that is the beauty of welding, it is actually not very difficult - it just takes LOTS of practice to be come proficient. Many people can 'make things stick together' but to actually do a decent weld just takes practice. Did I mention that welding takes practice? I think I did... The best thing I ever did was sign up for a quick course at the local tech school (years ago), I was taught the correct way the first time, I didn't have to fight my way out or through all the wrong things.
GPER
Jeeper
There are a number of things the will effect your welder choice. I had the 110 mig, but I have 220 in the garage so I bought the Hobart 175 with the gas set up. I hear the Miller can be fine tuned better for sheet metal. I find the 220 is easier to weld with and is better for bumpers.
I'm not saying bumpers and such can't be done with a 110 because it can and I did most of my stuff with it.I did bevel the edges more for the smaller welder. So it will be what wiring you have or are willing to put in. The time it will take to weld heavier stock when the duty cycle kicks out on the 110 machine. Flux core wire is about twice the price as solid wire used with the gas.
Follow the welding machines recommended settings for the thickness of the metal you are welding. That and practice pushing or pulling your puddles will help a lot and don't burn on galvanized metals.
I'm not saying bumpers and such can't be done with a 110 because it can and I did most of my stuff with it.I did bevel the edges more for the smaller welder. So it will be what wiring you have or are willing to put in. The time it will take to weld heavier stock when the duty cycle kicks out on the 110 machine. Flux core wire is about twice the price as solid wire used with the gas.
Follow the welding machines recommended settings for the thickness of the metal you are welding. That and practice pushing or pulling your puddles will help a lot and don't burn on galvanized metals.
CJ
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BrockGrimes
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fishinfool98
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2 D-8 batteries a set of jumper cables and a jumper wire
definatly go with 220
definatly go with 220
GPER
Jeeper
I saw a mechanic do that with small jumper wires and solder. I had a loose wire on the dozer I was running and it was a smaller scale of the welding with the batteries. He fixed the loose connection and I had to go back to work.
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Ahhh, which welder to buy; an age old question... My thoughts are to buy more welder than what you currently need, as you will definitely find many more uses than what you think. I've actually recouped some of my cost on various small jobs for friends, work, etc... Alot comes into play; budget, material thickness, steel or aluminum, shop set-up, fequency of use, and the all important duty cycle. In my case I bought a Miller DVI; works on 115v or 220v. Fairly portable for use away from the home shop (my wife and I can lift it into my truck)... A very high quality unit; great parts support and will weld from 22g sheet metal up to 3/8" in a single pass. I've welded 1/4" plate on the 115v setting, in a single pass, with great penetration. For me, it's about all the welder I would need for anything automotive; but still leaves room for the occasional "industrial" type job. With this welder in the 220v mode; I would not even think twice about doing my own welding on something that's as important as a roll cage. Of course, this is JMHO!!
TeamRush
Active Jeeper
Without question the easiest way to weld is with a MIG (Metal electrode, Inert Gas shielding).
With a MIG welder, you can do a LOT of work, and do it EASILY!
Remember, you can REVERSE the polarity,
(Positive Electrode, Negative work piece) and turn the amperage down and weld thin stuff.
If you are doing body work,
Get yourself some 'Easy Grind' wire to do the work with, so you don't spend the next six months trying to grind down hard welds!
------------------------------
If you want to dig down, and make welds in heavy material,
Then run STRAIGHT POLARITY...
(Positive workpiece, Negative Electrode) and turn the amperage up to dig in and have much deeper penetration.
------------------------------
Most MIG welders will also run FLUX CORE WIRE that DOES NOT require gas to use.
IT spatters and pops a lot, and you will have to chip slag off the weld just like a stick welder when you are done,
But this will allow you to use the welder in open air, outside or on the trail somewhere.
-------------------------------
Many of us that have done this for a while use 'DUAL SHIELD'....
That's GAS & FLUX CORE at the same time.
The welds come out MUCH smoother than if you just use Flux core wire alone, but you still have to chip slag off the weld...
The slag (Flux Shielding Material) will also help keep the heat in the weld longer and helps prevent weld cracking in some cases.
Dual Shield also allows you to weld in drafty places, indoor, outdoor, about any darn where you feel like striking a bead!
-----------------------------------------
Your best looking welds are going to come from GAS SHIELD and solid wire (No Flux)...
They make some really PRETTY welds (almost like TIG, but without being a pain in the butt and taking forever to get anything done!)
And plain gas shielding is VERY FAST if you are working indoors without drafts to the gas shielding stays in place.
------------------------------------------
YOUR ENEMY IS 'CONTAMINATION' IN ANY WELD!
Make sure the metal is CLEAN, CLEAN, then CLEAN IT AGAIN!
NEVER try and weld rust, paint, grease, grime, ect.!
I grind the metal down clean, then usually wipe it down with a no residue solvent before welding!
ANY CONTAMINATION IN THE WELD WILL WEAKEN IT!
So make sure you have CLEAN mating surfaces!
Do NOT attempt to weld through 'Mill Scale', 'Black Plating' or any other corrosion limiting coating!
Sand or grind it off before starting your weld, and your weld will be stronger an turn out MUCH better!
-------------------------------------
Use MILD STEEL when you can, it's less expensive,
Works better, welds easier, you don't have to worry about the HAZ (Heat Affect Zone) like you do with Chrome-Molly tubing and such.
Mild steel makes for a MUCH better cage and most components since mild steel will give and most of the time spring back into place,
Where once you bend Chrome-Molly, it's just bent and there is nothing you can do about it!
Most racing vehicles want you to use Mild Steel now since mild steel will absorb much of the shock as it bends, instead of delivering all that impact to the driver!
----------------------------------
Take the time to FIT YOUR PARTS!
The better the fit, the better the weld will be, and the stronger the joint will be!
I spend about 4X as much time fitting than I do welding!
The closer the fit, the less filler you will have to use, and the stronger the joint will be!
Also, the better the fit, the less filler, the less HEAT you will have to apply to the area and the less likely you will have thermal cracking at that weld.
Speaking of thermal cracking,
NEVER complete a straight line weld, even on straight run plates...
A straight weld, even around a tube, will allow the weld to crack in a straight, unimpeded line (if a crack starts)...
Apply several 'Tack' welds around the work piece...
3 or 4 on a tube,
tack weld each end on a straight line run weld, then tack weld about every two or three inches...
Then alternate between about 1.5 to 2 inches of weld, then move to the other end or the other side of the project and weld another 1.5 or 2" max, then alternate back to where you made the first weld, and skip about the length of the weld, and apply another weld,
Then skip back to the other end/side and do the same thing...
These SPACES between welds and alternating between ends/sides will help do TWO things...
One is keep the work piece from OVERHEATING and WARPING to
...And the second is, by doing the weld, skip, weld, skip, weld skip...
Then coming back later when things have cooled off some and welding in the gaps,
If any crack gets started, it won't be able to 'RUN'...
It will stop at the next weld start...
Same with tubing, Weld in about three short runs of weld, about 1/6 of a turn apart,
Then come back later and complete the other three welds in the openings you left.
If the tube weld decides to crack, it can only crack to the next short weld and then it has to stop!
Anyway, there are some basics, hope it helps you figure out some of the 'Beginner' stuff out!
Welding is like playing a guitar,
Many people can pick it up easily, and do it poorly,
but it takes many years of dedicated practice to do it really well!
DIG
Jeeper
Without question the easiest way to weld is with a MIG (Metal electrode, Inert Gas shielding).
With a MIG welder, you can do a LOT of work, and do it EASILY!
Remember, you can REVERSE the polarity,
(Positive Electrode, Negative work piece) and turn the amperage down and weld thin stuff.
If you are doing body work,
Get yourself some 'Easy Grind' wire to do the work with, so you don't spend the next six months trying to grind down hard welds!
------------------------------
If you want to dig down, and make welds in heavy material,
Then run STRAIGHT POLARITY...
(Positive workpiece, Negative Electrode) and turn the amperage up to dig in and have much deeper penetration.
------------------------------
Most MIG welders will also run FLUX CORE WIRE that DOES NOT require gas to use.
IT spatters and pops a lot, and you will have to chip slag off the weld just like a stick welder when you are done,
But this will allow you to use the welder in open air, outside or on the trail somewhere.
-------------------------------
Many of us that have done this for a while use 'DUAL SHIELD'....
That's GAS & FLUX CORE at the same time.
The welds come out MUCH smoother than if you just use Flux core wire alone, but you still have to chip slag off the weld...
The slag (Flux Shielding Material) will also help keep the heat in the weld longer and helps prevent weld cracking in some cases.
Dual Shield also allows you to weld in drafty places, indoor, outdoor, about any darn where you feel like striking a bead!
-----------------------------------------
Your best looking welds are going to come from GAS SHIELD and solid wire (No Flux)...
They make some really PRETTY welds (almost like TIG, but without being a pain in the butt and taking forever to get anything done!)
And plain gas shielding is VERY FAST if you are working indoors without drafts to the gas shielding stays in place.
------------------------------------------
YOUR ENEMY IS 'CONTAMINATION' IN ANY WELD!
Make sure the metal is CLEAN, CLEAN, then CLEAN IT AGAIN!
NEVER try and weld rust, paint, grease, grime, ect.!
I grind the metal down clean, then usually wipe it down with a no residue solvent before welding!
ANY CONTAMINATION IN THE WELD WILL WEAKEN IT!
So make sure you have CLEAN mating surfaces!
Do NOT attempt to weld through 'Mill Scale', 'Black Plating' or any other corrosion limiting coating!
Sand or grind it off before starting your weld, and your weld will be stronger an turn out MUCH better!
-------------------------------------
Use MILD STEEL when you can, it's less expensive,
Works better, welds easier, you don't have to worry about the HAZ (Heat Affect Zone) like you do with Chrome-Molly tubing and such.
Mild steel makes for a MUCH better cage and most components since mild steel will give and most of the time spring back into place,
Where once you bend Chrome-Molly, it's just bent and there is nothing you can do about it!
Most racing vehicles want you to use Mild Steel now since mild steel will absorb much of the shock as it bends, instead of delivering all that impact to the driver!
----------------------------------
Take the time to FIT YOUR PARTS!
The better the fit, the better the weld will be, and the stronger the joint will be!
I spend about 4X as much time fitting than I do welding!
The closer the fit, the less filler you will have to use, and the stronger the joint will be!
Also, the better the fit, the less filler, the less HEAT you will have to apply to the area and the less likely you will have thermal cracking at that weld.
Speaking of thermal cracking,
NEVER complete a straight line weld, even on straight run plates...
A straight weld, even around a tube, will allow the weld to crack in a straight, unimpeded line (if a crack starts)...
Apply several 'Tack' welds around the work piece...
3 or 4 on a tube,
tack weld each end on a straight line run weld, then tack weld about every two or three inches...
Then alternate between about 1.5 to 2 inches of weld, then move to the other end or the other side of the project and weld another 1.5 or 2" max, then alternate back to where you made the first weld, and skip about the length of the weld, and apply another weld,
Then skip back to the other end/side and do the same thing...
These SPACES between welds and alternating between ends/sides will help do TWO things...
One is keep the work piece from OVERHEATING and WARPING to
And the second is, by doing the weld, skip, weld, skip, weld skip...
Then coming back later when things have cooled off some and welding in the gaps,
If any crack gets started, it won't be able to 'RUN'...
It will stop at the next weld start...
Same with tubing, Weld in about three short runs of weld, about 1/6 of a turn apart,
Then come back later and complete the other three welds in the openings you left.
If the tube weld decides to crack, it can only crack to the next short weld and then it has to stop!
Anyway, there are some basics, hope it helps you figure out some of the 'Beginner' stuff out!
Welding is like playing a guitar,
Many people can pick it up easily, and do it poorly,
but it takes many years of dedicated practice to do it really well!
wow buddy! You have to be a welder at heart! Man that is awesome, I printed it off and have it hanging in my garage.! Thanks everyone for the input!TeamRush
Active Jeeper
All I learned the HARD WAY!
Welding Terms, "Straight Polarity"...
Is backwards of the Direct Current you are used to working with in your vehicles...
Keep that in mind, and you will do much better!
With the work piece 'Positive', and the electrode 'Negative', the weld will 'DIG' deeper, and you get better penetration, And the gun tip stays MUCH cooler.
If you are doing something where you don't want deep penetration, like sheet metal, Then REVERSE the terminals inside the welder...
The transformer leads usually come out right next to the wire drive motor and pinch rollers, just swap them side for side...
This will heat you gun up more, But with sheet metal, you should be running lower current anyway, so it's not a huge issue.
You might want to turn the gas flow up to help carry off more of the heat from the gun and work piece also... Keeps the gun from overheating, and cools the work piece so it doesn't warp as easily... ...............................................
Early Jeep bodies were thicker, made of plain old steel, But newer Jeeps are made of very specific alloys that don't take to excessive heat very well...
With early Jeeps, if you were welding around bends in the body (body lines, rounded edges, ect.) the stiffened metal didn't warp very easily, But if you get into the middle of a panel, like the center of a hood or top of a fender, the heat WILL warp the metal if you weld very much at a time!
........................................................
I do 'Spot Welds', one about every three inches, then use a cold rag on the metal to take the heat out, then do some more spot welds about every three inches... then cool the work... Repeat until all the 'Spot' welds connect...
There is some stuff called 'Heat Dam', and it's a clay like substance you can put around the weld area before you weld, and it will suck the heat out of the weld area to help keep it from warping...
I've been able to weld on metal and not burn the paint back more than about 1/2" with plumbers putty or 'Heat Dam' from a welding shop!
It REALLY takes the heat out of the thin metals.
I use 'Plumbers Putty', it's cheap, works GREAT! and since I'm not going to reuse it, I don't worry about keeping it clean.
It's cheap, non toxic and available at any hardware store that carries plumbing supplies.
I buy the large tubs because I use the out of it and it's cheaper that way. ----------------------------------------
If you are welding on VERY thin stuff, or need to attach a heavy piece to very thin stuff, (like putting in body supports under the tub, or putting in anchors for SPORT bars or seat belts, ect.)
Put a piece of COPPER behind the THIN piece of metal, and it will help keep the thin stuff from blowing through as you weld.
The same copper piece works good for very thin metal seams or joints. Just flatten out a piece of copper tubing, and use it behind the thin stuff...
You will be AMAZED how well copper backing works to keep the 'Blow Through' to a minimum!
It's CHEAP, Effective, and easy to do, and it will save you a TON of problems in the long run!
I learned the HARD WAY!Welding Terms, "Straight Polarity"...
Is backwards of the Direct Current you are used to working with in your vehicles...
Keep that in mind, and you will do much better!
With the work piece 'Positive', and the electrode 'Negative', the weld will 'DIG' deeper, and you get better penetration, And the gun tip stays MUCH cooler.
If you are doing something where you don't want deep penetration, like sheet metal, Then REVERSE the terminals inside the welder...
The transformer leads usually come out right next to the wire drive motor and pinch rollers, just swap them side for side...
This will heat you gun up more, But with sheet metal, you should be running lower current anyway, so it's not a huge issue.
You might want to turn the gas flow up to help carry off more of the heat from the gun and work piece also... Keeps the gun from overheating, and cools the work piece so it doesn't warp as easily... ...............................................
Early Jeep bodies were thicker, made of plain old steel, But newer Jeeps are made of very specific alloys that don't take to excessive heat very well...
With early Jeeps, if you were welding around bends in the body (body lines, rounded edges, ect.) the stiffened metal didn't warp very easily, But if you get into the middle of a panel, like the center of a hood or top of a fender, the heat WILL warp the metal if you weld very much at a time!
........................................................
I do 'Spot Welds', one about every three inches, then use a cold rag on the metal to take the heat out, then do some more spot welds about every three inches... then cool the work... Repeat until all the 'Spot' welds connect...
There is some stuff called 'Heat Dam', and it's a clay like substance you can put around the weld area before you weld, and it will suck the heat out of the weld area to help keep it from warping...
I've been able to weld on metal and not burn the paint back more than about 1/2" with plumbers putty or 'Heat Dam' from a welding shop!
It REALLY takes the heat out of the thin metals.
I use 'Plumbers Putty', it's cheap, works GREAT! and since I'm not going to reuse it, I don't worry about keeping it clean.
It's cheap, non toxic and available at any hardware store that carries plumbing supplies.
I buy the large tubs because I use the
out of it and it's cheaper that way. ---------------------------------------- If you are welding on VERY thin stuff, or need to attach a heavy piece to very thin stuff, (like putting in body supports under the tub, or putting in anchors for SPORT bars or seat belts, ect.)
Put a piece of COPPER behind the THIN piece of metal, and it will help keep the thin stuff from blowing through as you weld.
The same copper piece works good for very thin metal seams or joints. Just flatten out a piece of copper tubing, and use it behind the thin stuff...
You will be AMAZED how well copper backing works to keep the 'Blow Through' to a minimum!
It's CHEAP, Effective, and easy to do, and it will save you a TON of problems in the long run!
Last edited:
A lot of good advice, but do yourself a huge favor and take a class or two at a local college and learn how to weld the right way the first time. I was a self taught welder and thought I knew my stuff. Until I had to trouble shoot poor welds, do out of position welds, and needed to learn TIG. It was then I took some classes and the instructor recommended I take some more classes. Man what a world of difference that made. By self teaching you pick up bad habits without even knowing they are bad. You just think thats the way it is done because nobody showed you the right way from the start.