windshield and frame

[IOPort51]

I don’t think I will find any arguments that CJ windshields are not their strongest or most loved feature. The frames rust from the inside and some times even take the top of the tub with them, all with no indication of a problem, kind of like having termites in the house.
And then there is the glass itself, how many of us have the “jack frost” effect around the edges? What the heck is that?? I have been told it is trapped moisture between the laminations, how did it get their? It’s glass for crying out loud!! It’s supposed to be as water proof as you can get!!
I have noticed that the frost is often most evident on the bottom edge which leads me to believe the laminations are separating from the pressure on the edge of a rough ride at too steep an angle.
Is there any one out there that knows enough about auto glass to have an opinion on weather there is good glass and bad glass, It was the best deal I could find, the last time I replaced the glass, but I don’t remember it being that much less expensive than the most expensive I found. Did I get Chinese glass or maybe Mexican glass and is that a bad thing of a good thing??
I have been thinking that if the glass is starting to delaminate or has moisture between laminations will a couple of hours of patient heat gun application make the frost go away? Or more likely not heating the entire piece of glass evenly will make it crack when one area expands more than the rest?
Last and certainly not least is the frame rust problem. I can see how condensation could happen when running the defrost and/or just having warm moist air from the cabin come in contact with the outer, non insulated surface of the frame.
It wouldn’t take much to insulate it, I think you could pretty much fill the frame with expanding foam every place but where the wiper system operated. And where the wipers needed the space Perhaps spray under coating would do the job.
As you may have guessed I am planning on replacing the frame and windshield and I try to replace things that have failed with things that won’t.
If any body has any constructive thoughts on this subject or has addressed the problem with any success I would be interested in your opinions.

 

[BajaEdition]

I don’t think I will find any arguments that CJ windshields are not their strongest or most loved feature. The frames rust from the inside and some times even take the top of the tub with them, all with no indication of a problem, kind of like having termites in the house.
And then there is the glass itself, how many of us have the “jack frost” effect around the edges? What the heck is that?? I have been told it is trapped moisture between the laminations, how did it get their? It’s glass for crying out loud!! It’s supposed to be as water proof as you can get!!
I have noticed that the frost is often most evident on the bottom edge which leads me to believe the laminations are separating from the pressure on the edge of a rough ride at too steep an angle.
Is there any one out there that knows enough about auto glass to have an opinion on weather there is good glass and bad glass, It was the best deal I could find, the last time I replaced the glass, but I don’t remember it being that much less expensive than the most expensive I found. Did I get Chinese glass or maybe Mexican glass and is that a bad thing of a good thing??
I have been thinking that if the glass is starting to delaminate or has moisture between laminations will a couple of hours of patient heat gun application make the frost go away? Or more likely not heating the entire piece of glass evenly will make it crack when one area expands more than the rest?
Last and certainly not least is the frame rust problem. I can see how condensation could happen when running the defrost and/or just having warm moist air from the cabin come in contact with the outer, non insulated surface of the frame.
It wouldn’t take much to insulate it, I think you could pretty much fill the frame with expanding foam every place but where the wiper system operated. And where the wipers needed the space Perhaps spray under coating would do the job.
As you may have guessed I am planning on replacing the frame and windshield and I try to replace things that have failed with things that won’t.
If any body has any constructive thoughts on this subject or has addressed the problem with any success I would be interested in your opinions.

great question, I would love to know the answer.
We live in a world of the cheapest product gets the bid, so I would love to know how to tell quality fron in a windshield.

 

[BrockGrimes]

If you don't want rust get a fiberglass frame had one on mine and it worked great.
It even took the impact of the hood blowing up at 45,mph.

As for filling it with foam or insulation, forget it, it'll trap moisture and rust even quicker, not to mention making a repair almost impossible.

You might could rig up a sprayer and shoot POR-15 inside the frame as far as you could reach, it should cover the usual rust areas.

Beyond that not much else, I liked the fiberglass frame and would get one again but they are pricey.

 

[IOPort51]

The frame would have to be completely filled with foam to eliminate any moisture. I believe the moisture is condensation rather than water from the exterior, rain water.
Fiberglass is a very interesting possibility, how well did it hold onto your soft top?? Did the WW wiper motor attach well?

 

[BrockGrimes]

You wouldn't even know it was fiberglass, everything matched up perfectly.

 

[IOPort51]

You wouldn't even know it was fiberglass, everything matched up perfectly.

I would guess it had steel reinforcement at the hinged and wiper motor mount?
I will research this further but if you have a supplier name or even better a brand name it would be appreciated.

 

[BrockGrimes]

Have one in the garage, I'll check when I get a chance.

 

[IOPort51]

Have one in the garage, I'll check when I get a chance.

thanks, at your convenience.

 

[coldwater]

The only time I have seen auto glass delaminate was simply due to age. With the new process and materials, I haven't heard of one giving up like that. I refuse to use steel frames any more, and you know why. Good quality glass frames have it all over the steel ones hands down. Theattachment holes have nuts glassed in, and I have never had fit problems with one of any kind. Aside from mine, I have prolly put 6-8 of them on other Jeeps, and love them.

By the way, all of them were from 4WDHardware.
http://www.4wd.com/productdetails.aspx?partID=5498

 

[IOPort51]

The only time I have seen auto glass delaminate was simply due to age. With the new process and materials, I haven't heard of one giving up like that. I refuse to use steel frames any more, and you know why. Good quality glass frames have it all over the steel ones hands down. Theattachment holes have nuts glassed in, and I have never had fit problems with one of any kind. Aside from mine, I have prolly put 6-8 of them on other Jeeps, and love them.

By the way, all of them were from 4WDHardware.

Thanks Dave. I'm going to look at them.

 

[coldwater]

They aint cheap, but It is a once and done for good deal, so to me....worth it.

 

[IOPort51]

Thanks Dave. I'm going to look at them.

you were not just woffing about being pricey. are they reinforced at the top to allow the mount channel for the soft top to be attached with sheet metal screws?? I would also want to mount the wings for the soft doors, not as much stress but I guess if you hit it with your shoulder getting in or out it could strip out plain fiberglass.

 

[coldwater]

My top channel is mounted with the stock screws, and I had the door channels mounted, but took them off when I quit using the top. Never any problems at all. Their tougher than you may think. Mine is now 13 years old, and is 100%

 

[brian613]

if someone was good with making fiberglass stuff it wouldnt be too hard to make a mold of your steel windshield frame and then make your own fiberglass frame...

 

[IOPort51]

if someone was good with making fiberglass stuff it wouldnt be too hard to make a mold of your steel windshield frame and then make your own fiberglass frame...

even better, carbon fiber.
I am not that big a fan of working with fiber glass but it is do-able.
A carbon fiber windshield frame could just about make a front roll cage.
hmmm.

 

[JSnow]

would look pretty sweet too. My windshield leaked water through the bottom, which in turn poured into the defroster duct of the frame, even after replacing the gasket. I ran a silicone bead along the inside. hopefully that'll at least slow the rust down now that it doesn't puddle up inside anymore.

 

[coldwater]

if someone was good with making fiberglass stuff it wouldnt be too hard to make a mold of your steel windshield frame and then make your own fiberglass frame...

Not that easy. You need to have templates for front and back, because the frame is not solid, but hollow inside. You would need precise thickness and a good method for bonding the two halves together. The nuts would also need to be glassed into EXACTLY the right places, and all the openings would need the same attention to detail. Then there's the gelcoat issues as well. Cheaper to just buy one the experts have made for you.