Chewed Ring and pinion Dana 30

[JR74CJ5]

So i popped off my diff covers for the first time sence buying my cj and the front Dana 30 is in bad shape. Missing over an 8th of the teeth in one spot of the ring gear.

Looking for new ring and pinion gear with the 4.27 ratio

Couple questions:

1) Found at jaws gears a dana/spicer oem kit for $280 and tognattis sells a "Motive gear performance diff" brand for 450.88 What is the big differance? is the motive brand that much better?

2) while in this "issue" should i look at changing gearing? I like the free way speed now, haven't had the chance to hard-core wheel it yet, runn 33's (I know i would have to change the rear dana 40 gear ratio to match)
And figuring even if i wanted to gear down i could change my transmittion to a 4 speed with granny low instead (as the tranny rebuild / swap is soon to come)

Thoughts?

Cheers

 

[Cheepjeep85]

is it mostly street driven? if it is and your happy with your power and cruising speed then id leave it alone. as far as the gear brands, if you don't plan on bigger tires and hardcore off roading, then id stick with a cheaper brand and save you some money, if your more comfortable buying a more expensive name brand then go for it, id say there are some differences in strength in em.

 

[BusaDave9]

1) Found at jaws gears a dana/spicer oem kit for $280 and tognattis sells a "Motive gear performance diff" brand for 450.88 What is the big differance? is the motive brand that much better?
Cheers

$451 is a very high price just for a ring and pinion gear set. Maybe it also includes an installation kit. The installation kit has bearings, shims and seals. Usually an installation kit costs about $100 so even then $451 sounds high. I was going to check it out but I am not familiar with Tognattis. What's their web site?
You should never pay $451 for a ring and pinion gear set, no matter how high the quality.

 

[Sasquach]

See what Randy's Ring and Pinion has to offer. I am no drivetrain expert but I would replace with a Dana/Spicer gear set and run from any foreign made stuff, it is not something you ever want to worry about or have to redo.

 

[JR74CJ5]

is it mostly street driven? if it is and your happy with your power and cruising speed then id leave it alone. as far as the gear brands, if you don't plan on bigger tires and hardcore off roading, then id stick with a cheaper brand and save you some money, if your more comfortable buying a more expensive name brand then go for it, id say there are some differences in strength in em.

It's mostly driven on the street until i get to the trail Not really a DD, but want it drivable far on the highway, and I'll be doing some Rubicon Runs when i get everything good to go...

So I do like the ratio i currently have...

@ BusaDave9: I think they are just higher priced... Tognotti's has a reputation for being higher than most...

Here's their site ( Tognotti's Auto / Truck / Import World ), Part # 706000-8X

and Jaws Gear's too( JawsGear.com ).

Jaws isn't showing if their Dana kit is install kit or gears only... I'm calling in a couple hours to see...

@ Sasquach: I'm with you man... Randy's is a little further south than me, and Jaws helped a family member out of a bind, so i'm a little partial to em, but doesn't mean i wont check them out too... (Got to keep them honest you know) But i definatley want something that will not give me problems on the Rubicon...

So i did find one other option, but not sure if i should think about it in the front and rear, or just the rear. Its the Detroit Locker like this ( DETROIT LOCKER 3.73 & UP DET 162S-60B )

Found it elsewhere for around $350 or $380, but cant find it this am...

What about That option if I'm doing things in there already...

Thanks Guys , long winded i know... Sorry about that..

~ JR

 

[Old Dog]

If you drive on the road alot and the Rubicon I would get a selectable
like ARB, Ox or Eaton e-locker.
Now would also be the time to upgrade to 30 spline shafts with bigger joints.

 

[JR74CJ5]

If you drive on the road alot and the Rubicon I would get a selectable
like ARB, Ox or Eaton e-locker.
Now would also be the time to upgrade to 30 spline shafts with bigger joints.

Thanks Old Dog, I may wait on the lockers until i get it all together to do both front and rear at same time while beefing up the axles as recommended as well.

Think for now, i may just get a full rebuild kit from Randy's for the 4.27 Dana 30 . Running at 370.00 total with shipping...

One last question guys, While going through the "break in" period for the new R&P do i lock in the front AND put in 4 high around town so they'll wear and mesh / break in? or is locking the hubs enough? Not sure with the front what my procedure should be to break in correctly...

~ JR

 

[JR74CJ5]

See what Randy's Ring and Pinion has to offer. I am no drivetrain expert but I would replace with a Dana/Spicer gear set and run from any foreign made stuff, it is not something you ever want to worry about or have to redo.

Randy's actually can do pretty good for the full re-build kit. Thanks again man...

 

[Old Dog]

You just need to lock in the hubs. That will turn the gears.
Running it in 4 wheel would be better as it would put pressure
on the gears, but do it off the hard top so the driveline doesn't bind up.

 

[JR74CJ5]

You just need to lock in the hubs. That will turn the gears.
Running it in 4 wheel would be better as it would put pressure
on the gears, but do it off the hard top so the driveline doesn't bind up.

So then it would be "best" to install them, drive with front end unlocked to my local (ish) OHV park ( 25 Miles don't have many dirt roads around Sac, CA ), once off the pavement lock in and put in 4x4 and begin break in period slowly while there on the flatter dirt road trails? Make it an all day even just slowly breaking them in right? drive 20 min, cool 20 / drive 30 cool 30, drive, cool drive cool right?

Been reading, seems most say 500 mile break in... That's a lot of miles to go with the front locked in though... Wouldn't be able to do in a day, but after the initial day, just do the lock hubs, drive 2 wheel on pavement for a while?

What do you all do for a front R&P break in?

~ JR

 

[Old Dog]

I only did the drive on some dirt trails thing like you said.
after calling it a day, thats all the break-in mine got, thats been 6 years ago. Seems to have been enough.
Although I did change my fluid again after a couple hundred miles off road.

 

[BusaDave9]

Thanks Old Dog, I may wait on the lockers until i get it all together to do both front and rear at same time while beefing up the axles as recommended as well.
~ JR

If you ever plan on getting a locker up front I say do it now. Regearing a diff is a big job. Whether you do it yourself or pay someone else you dont want to do it twice (unless it's avoidable). If you get new gears now and not a locker I bet you never will get a locker. And that's just fine if you don't want a locker I'm just saying it's a big wast of time and money to do it twice.

If you drive on the road alot and the Rubicon I would get a selectable
like ARB, Ox or Eaton e-locker.

I agree with Old Dog here. I am a huge fan of selectable lockers. I have an OX locker in my CJ5 and I installed an ARB in the CJ7 I used to have. They are the way to go if you use your jeep on and off road.
A selectable locker does cost a lot more than the Detroit Locker. If you really can't afford to buy a selectable locker now I would get a Detroit Locker. I know money doesn't grow on trees but I think my first advice is more important than my second suggestion: if you ever want a locker, get it now even if it isn't the locker of choice. That front diff is out of the picture when you are in 2WD and then when you are in 4WD it will keep you moving.

 

[Sasquach]

Just a little feedback...I have a Detroit in the rear and offroad it's awesome, one the road not so although I am starting to not notice it as much. If your CJ spends allot of time on pavement you want to think hard about it.

 

[JR74CJ5]

Yeah I'm thinking of a Electronic selectable locker in the front and Detroit locker in the rear. But I'm leaning towards buying them at a later date, for a more extensive tear-down re-build...

BusaDave9, i agree with you about not wanting to do it twice , but i am thinking if I'm going to buy those expensive lockers, i want to buy the right ones and do it once... That being said I've been looking into Old Dog's recommendation (Now would also be the time to upgrade to 30 spline shafts with bigger joints.) Been reading on the Chromemolly Axles. And am thinking of a disk brake set up in the front (at least) ... and the list keeps going... So right now, I think my best option is to get the R&P gears and install them in as is for now, pile my garage full of parts to be ready for the Down to frame re-build I'm getting closer to doing...

But I'm just rambling now... Thanks Guys for all the info... :booze:

​

 

[Old Dog]

Just changing the carrier to a locker later is not that hard to do
the pinion will already be set, all you have to do is reset the ring gear.
You could have a machine shop measure (if you don't have the equipment)
the difference between the two, and reset the shims for the correct backlash.
I put the locker in mine and got it right the frist time.

 

[JR74CJ5]

So I can get just the R&P gears only and reuse the shims etc, for $280 in town. Or get the whole install kit with bearings (Carrier and ring?) shims, basically everything ecept spider gears for 370 including shipping.

Question is should I go whole kit? I just want to change out the new R&P and reuse everything else that appears good in there. Hoping the shims would be correct already.

Unrealistic?

~ JR

 

[Old Dog]

The bearings are pressed on, since your reusing the carrier you might be ok there. The pinion might be a different story though, it could be damaged getting it off the old pinion. Chances are the shim pack will work but you might need to rearrange them for the proper engagement.
Are you going to do it or have a shop do it? If a shop is doing it they should have bearings and shims if needed.

 

[JR74CJ5]

The only thing I don't have the guts to mess with on this thing is rthe tranny rebuild... I'll give it a shot. But worst case I'll go grab a kit.

 

[Sasquach]

The pinion will have a + or -.00x number etched on the gear end that determines how deep it wants to be set in the case, If you were very lucky and got the same final assembly etched # you would reuse the shims you have otherwise you will need a pack for this. The carrier has the shims inboard of the bearings on a 44 and it become more difficult and more expensive to do than the AMC20 , so you will need set up bearings and shims as well as new bearings once you get it shimmed correctly.
I made my set up bearings from a set of new bearings that I dremeled the inner bore to slide on and off easily(Thank you CJ for that tip), this is cheaper than buying the set up bearings.
I no longer need them and I have carrier and pinion shims too that I can let go of.

 

[Sasquach]

One other thing I found is taking the timken or national bearing number right off the bearing and google it for the cheapest source, You will find these bearings can be had for much less this way in some cases.