ignition issue

ignition issue

palmirage

Jeeper
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Location
Long Island, Bahamas
Vehicle(s)
79 cj 7 258 4spd manual, 83 cj 5 258 5 spd manual
Help! I can usually fix the mechanical problems on my 79 CJ 7 but electrical issues always seem to confuse me. It has a 258 with 4 spd manual. I started it up yesterday morning and it was running a little rough, so I turned it off and when I went to restart it won't. Turns over no problem, took air cleaner off and carb is getting gas, no spark at the plugs though. Took coil wire out of dist. cap and no spark there. Voltmeter at positive, neg. & top of coil with the ignition on reads 26.6. Ohms on positive and neg. on coil - 8.2. Where to go from here? Coil, Ignition module, neutral switch?

Thanks in advance.
 
I would be looking at the module, I don't think you have a neuteal switch.
Does the red wire on the coil have 12V to ground when the switch is in run??:cool: thats the one comming from the switch.:cool:

Help! I can usually fix the mechanical problems on my 79 CJ 7 but electrical issues always seem to confuse me. It has a 258 with 4 spd manual. I started it up yesterday morning and it was running a little rough, so I turned it off and when I went to restart it won't. Turns over no problem, took air cleaner off and carb is getting gas, no spark at the plugs though. Took coil wire out of dist. cap and no spark there. Voltmeter at positive, neg. & top of coil with the ignition on reads 26.6. Ohms on positive and neg. on coil - 8.2. Where to go from here? Coil, Ignition module, neutral switch?

Thanks in advance.
 
The coil is a step up transformer.. It takes the 12-13 V on start up and the 12-13V/ 1.35 Ohm for voltage on Engine RUN. The coil steps up the voltage and applies the higher voltage 20k-45,000 Volts to the spark plug gap.

The coils do get banged up and get internal shorts. Where there is a voltage charge and not GOOD ground to spark to the coil will short out internal. The Voltage jump internal to the coil will put small shorts across the magnet wire by melting the formvar insulation (like shelack coating). The more shorts the less windings and the less the voltage will be put out.

Poor Grounds cause shorts in coil.... and is the reason the spark plug boot should not just be pulled off to see is engine changes. That will cause small shorts in coil. We have all done this but not a good idea.... we have a 30 yr old truck... I am sure the spark plug boot has been pulled off a few times. If a spark plug boot is pulled give it a good ground to engine prior to stating or running.

There is a RESISTANCE reading on the coil that can be done with a multimeter. The fixed winding will have a resistance range.... if lower than the range it has shorts and net effect of having less windings/coil winds or it will have a high resistance and means the coil wire broke and has a short now. Multiple short in the coil is common, esp when you consider some of us have 30 yr old coils.

The resistance range to test your old coil is below. The test procedure can be found in the Jeep Field Service Manual, FSM in the Ignition Section. Also found in the aftermarket manuals.
1.... Primary Resistance Test..
remove coil connector. Measure ohms from the neg to pos terminal on teh coil. Should read 1.13 - 1.23 ohms at 75F degrees
2... Secondary Resistance TEst.....
remove ignition wire from center terminal. Measure ohms from center terminal (coil spark plug wire) and either terminal on the coil. REsistance should measure 7700 - 9300 ohms at 75F





POOR GROUNDS kill the COIL and the spark needs good gounds for the DC Spark to get to the spark plug gap and onto the battery. DC make a complete loop from the battery to the auto and back to battery.

Upgrades I learned from JeepHammer for spark energy & Control:
1..Use premium spark plug wires. I use the MSD premiums or the NApa Drk Navy Beldins.

2..Use copper antizeise on the spark plug threads. Helps with the grounding and many heads are alumium and the plug has steel threads. Aluminum oxidation happens in air, not to mention a 220F engine, not to mention its no in contact with steel. Steel and Alumium a no no with out antizeise. Even for your small engines too.

3..Ground your heads. The spark engergy needs to jump the spark plug gap to light the fire. The strap is a ground from the threads and engine head. The head is often alumium, sits on a steel block, uses a thick gasket and has oil varnish, chemicals, and 30 yrs of corrosion and use. These do not have the best ground. It helps a great deal to ground your head or both heads with a 14 or 12 awg wire.

4..Ground your IGNITION Modual. The ignition modual gets its ground from the Distributor. The distributor is cast alumium, sits on a steel block (issue galvonic corrosion & oil varnsih) and is the GROUND for the Ford DuraSpark Igntion used Jeep in the late 70's and 80's. Poor Ignition Ground will yield poor performance and the weak ground can kill your Jeep DuraSpark Ignition Modual, it will get hot, melt the black potting compound, and you will see black goop oosing out of the Igntion Modual on the drivers fender.
Can ground the Ignition two ways.
A... Ground the Distributor
B... Ground the black wire going to the DuraSpark Ignition Modual. THe modual on drivers fender has two connectors. One has a black wire, that is gound. I cut this wire on the HARNESS SIDE NOT THE IGNITION MODUAL SIDE. We cut the harness side so the mod stays with the jeep wire harness and if the Igntiion Modual needs to be swaped out the aux ground will always be there on the harness side. So cut the Black Gound Wire on the Harness side about 8 in from the connector. Slide on some heat shrink down the wire and solder in a 12-14 awg wire Black and long engough to reach the Neg Battery Terminal or the fire wall for the aux ground. Add some dielectric grease and shrink down the heatshrink to protect the new aux ground for igntion generation.


5.Do the ignition grounds above and you may get more pep, easier starts, better idle.

This would also be done with the TEAMRUSH larger cap & rotar during a tune up . New Spark plug wires and the autolite copper plugs. Do all this and I would say you will be 20% better pep, more rpms, better mileage, better starts, better idle. ON my 78 it was adding a 7th cylinder to my 258 six banger that had all new parts and a complete rebuild...

Big a affect on the 258 and even a bigger affect on the 8 cylinders since they have more rpm range.
 
excellent post, thanks. is this an original tutorial or is there another reference involved ? which ever it is, one heck of a reference.:cool:
 
Thanks for the for the thank you (s)


Yes I wrote the material.

I wrote all the upper material and looked in FSM for the resistance measurements as stated

The lower part was written by me also.... but JeepHammer is the one that came up with the tricks/grounds to correct the short commings of the CJ Igntion & Grounds.



Every CJ should have these tricks done.....
we have been talking about these tricks for a few years... huge benefits!
The computer control guys have more tricks that are needed.


Thanks,

Fred
 
Fred,

Thanks for the excellent info. Primary resistance test on coil 1.6 ohms, secondary 8200 ohms. Think the coil is ok. Looking to replace ignition module. What do you think of the MSD 6A? or should I just do the motorcraft? Upgrade the coil and distributer cap while I am at it?

Thanks again!!

Dan
 
Fred,

Thanks for the excellent info. Primary resistance test on coil 1.6 ohms, secondary 8200 ohms. Think the coil is ok. Looking to replace ignition module. What do you think of the MSD 6A? or should I just do the motorcraft? Upgrade the coil and distributer cap while I am at it?

Thanks again!!

Dan


Dan,

You are welcome.
Coil sounds ok per your resistance measurements above

I would measure your coil wire and plug wires... post the resistance and we will see what you have for resistance. If the coil wire was open you may not get a spark. That will tell us more about your plug wires...

When is the last time you replaced the cap, rotar, wires??
If the wires have high ohms... that will tell us more.

Do you have aluminum terminal cap????
take the cap off flip it and look under cap...... alumium caps are junk and once they get some spark engergy thru them the material starts to change and aluminum oxide is not conductive.... ALWAYS USE PREMIUM BRASS CAPS. Let us know


TEST your DuarSpark Modual for Free at Advance Auto or Autozone
The DuraSpark Modual is on the drivers fender and is a 6x6x2" box with two connectors. Look for any black potting compound type stuff and note. Remove & Take the DuraSpark Modual to Advance Auto and ask them to test as a Ford Igntion Modual, free test. If the modual test out and the spark plug wires ohm out ok.... you may have a ground issue....

If we have to buy or others buy a DuaSpark Modual... the best one I found was at Autozone they have the Ford E Coil and the Modual at a good price and both have lifetime warranty the last time I cked a yr ago.

The orginal Ford Motorcraft DuraSpark Moduals say "motorcraft" on them and are the best ones... Cannot get the good ones anymore and the current ones can fail often or you may have to try a few to get one that lives. Another good reason to make sure there are good grounds. Poor grounds IN or OUT can kill or weaken a ignition modual

Then ground the black wire... directions above
Then ground the engine head as said above

MSD 6AL..... great igntion and is one of the best upgrades to a CJ, more pep and better mileage better starts. These are full spark and 3 sparks/cylinder so way more energy than any other ignition we can afford anyway. Summit Racing sells these for $150-160. Buy it once and leave the stock ignition as back up and if you ever sell the CJ keep the MSD, use it on next project and let the use the sock ignition.

Let us know what you find... please do test above before you buy.

Fred





If we do not find the fault with the above action items, then there are more tests to do. The duraspark ignition has a full voltage start and a partial voltage run... so usually they do not both fail. So we have the above faults to take a look at first.

If we get the stock stuff running ...... and you want the MSD & TeamRush upgrade..... GREAT..... you will have a dual ignition. The ford E coil would also go very well with this path. I have all three. I would expect with MSD, TeamRush, Ford E Coil you would get 30% better pep & mileage. AGAIN.... you can always keep the MSD and use on next CJ. If you do this MSD from summit can buy the MSD cut to fit wires and can almost get two sets of wires for I6 if carefull. Those are the best plug wires.
 
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Fred,

Checked the resistance on the wires- coil 480 ohms, spark wires from 300 to 600 ohms. I replaced the wires 4 years ago when I got the Jeep with spiral core upgraded wires from Quadratech. Replaced the cap and rotor at the same time, although I didn't upgrade those. The cap is aluminun, but it doesn't look like it is damaged, while the rotor looks almost new.

Can't have the module checked at Autozone as I am in the Bahamas, can't even find a replacement new or used one on the island. I'll have to have order one and have it shipped on the mail boat. So I may as well order all the parts I may need to do the upgrades.

I did take the module off though, and the back has seperated from the housing and looks pretty corroded.

Thanks for your help.

Dan
 
Fred,

Checked the resistance on the wires- coil 480 ohms, spark wires from 300 to 600 ohms. I replaced the wires 4 years ago when I got the Jeep with spiral core upgraded wires from Quadratech.

Those look like good ohms to me... the longer ones have higher resistance. that is not issue

Replaced the cap and rotor at the same time, although I didn't upgrade those. The cap is aluminun, but it doesn't look like it is damaged, while the rotor looks almost new.

Alumium is junk new or used. We need a brass terminal cap. BorgWarner has a brass cap in the TEAMRUSH larger diameter taller cap... They usually have the "select" in the desc. I get their BorgWarner select parts from Oriley Auto and they come with life time warranty so it will be the last one I buy.

BUT.... this TEAMRUSH cap has male terminals so the wires are not the same male/female on the cap. Same for the E Core Coil if me/you/others use it has a male top.

I VERY STRONGLY SUGGEST TEAMRUSH.... is the ford ignitionparts that came out on the duraspark in the early 80s. Larger & taller cuts down on the inozation in the cap and the jumping of spark energy to the metal distributor body and it cuts down on cross fires to the wrong cylinder.

MSD has a great cap... the BEST material dielectric & its vented
MSD also has a great cut to fit wire set & will most likely get 2 sets out of the V8 kit..... you will need female on both ends of plug wires with this upgrade.



Can't have the module checked at Autozone as I am in the Bahamas, can't even find a replacement new or used one on the island. I'll have to have order one and have it shipped on the mail boat. So I may as well order all the parts I may need to do the upgrades.

I did take the module off though, and the back has seperated from the housing and looks pretty corroded.

Thanks for your help.

Dan

Lets do one thing before we give up on your duraspark modual.
I missed the bahamas location.... lucky dog.... I love to snorkle... been there a dozen times or so. Nice place.... its 0 deg F here and light snow for past 2 days. Burrr


Lets do one thing before we give up on your duraspark modual.
The salt spray and air can do wild things to vehilce there.... esp a CJ because we use std connectors and not weatherpack and so on. I think you lost grounds... Splice , solder, heat shink cover a ground to the input of your DuraSpark.... I talk about it above. When working the ignition or other electrical like lights... I want you to mate/unmate the connectors 8-10 times this will wipe the contacts and get down to cleanmetal. If the connector is gunked up you can use alcohol or such, old tooth brush, and try to clean up some before "wipe" mate action.

I then use Dielectric Grease and squeeze it into the female side and where the mate so it seals out moisture and dirt ect. Dielectric Grease is used after the clean & mates to preserve the work you just did. USE THIS EVERWHERE to protect your electrical connections..

I would also ground your head... I use the stud right behind the coil... its threaded and empty. Battery Ground, to there, that a block aux ground, then jumper to coil mtd (head) 3", one to frame, one to firewall, one to dash, one to duraspark modual and burried this one is the wire harness loom that is right there.

There is a good chance once we ground the durspark modual it might have spark since you said it worked in a intermitent and then nothing.

So try the Grounds...
Let us know how it goes.


Then if not go....
Order the TEAMRush style MSD cap & rotar from Summit
They have the MSD 6al
they have MSD cut to fit wires (the best)
Get a Ford E Coil is you have an extr $20 (make coil to cap for both coils)
The E coil can use faston tab or the connector to power coil
They also have a jumper from MSD fo FORD premaid its like $10

The msd box can mount on the passenger fender, if kit does not have rubber feet but those too. I think you need the rubber feet on that one... but they have been putting them in more of the CDI boxes. Run the MSD to battery neg, the soleniod right there has switched + use it, the distributor has a connector for the trigger signal and the MSD adapter will connect the MSD conn & your distributor. The MSD coil wires can have fastons on the ends and just plug into the tabs on coil... tabs are narrow like .187 tabs not the wider .250 ones. Done.

So the MSD needs -, switched + at solentiod, run two wires + - to coil ( coil is marked inside the housing area), and mate the signal wire to jeep distributor with the $10 jumper.

Back up ignition if all works... if switch coil input power wires, switch the jeep distributo connector to the Durspark Modual conn sitting there. I cover the unused connector with a photo film canister and put slit in top to slide over wire. Reconnect the Duraspark Aux ground that we added prior steps. The duraspark ground has to be removed in not in use... if we leave in ready to fire ignition it will over heat. Since the distributor connector was removed and we remove aux ground the Duraspark Modual cannot charge up, is not is use, and is safe till we need it.

That allows Jeepers to keep that great MSD for the next project. Where else can you get the best ignition for $160 and keep it for ever.


Let us know what the grounding does... 50/50 it fixes you up.
MSD would still be well worth while... I can direct you to parts and such too


Fred
 
was reading thru this and ya might do like i did this w/end.


i was getting frustrated with the stock duraspark,so it is now sittin in the trash can.


i put in a replacement h.e.i. that i found a link to thru here and super simple install.


one wire to run it and i got to loose about a half dozen wires plus a seperate coil and a module from under the hood:D

here is the one i bought, seems to work perfect and there customer service was top notch as i just called them on there phone number and ordered w/out usin the e-bay auction stuff.

AMC JEEP 232 258 4.0 4.2 6 CYL HEI DISTRIBUTOR 6511-R - eBay (item 370450516434 end time Jan-14-11 04:46:51 PST)

the quality looks to be top notch on the distributor i received also.


this might be another option for ya.
 
was reading thru this and ya might do like i did this w/end.


i was getting frustrated with the stock duraspark,so it is now sittin in the trash can.


i put in a replacement h.e.i. that i found a link to thru here and super simple install.


one wire to run it and i got to loose about a half dozen wires plus a seperate coil and a module from under the hood:D

here is the one i bought, seems to work perfect and there customer service was top notch as i just called them on there phone number and ordered w/out usin the e-bay auction stuff.

AMC JEEP 232 258 4.0 4.2 6 CYL HEI DISTRIBUTOR 6511-R - eBay (item 370450516434 end time Jan-14-11 04:46:51 PST)

the quality looks to be top notch on the distributor i received also.


this might be another option for ya.


HEI use in the AMC Jeep Engines is a TIME BOMB waiting to happen.


would not use a HEI modual it it was given to me.​

would not touch a engine that has a hei unless it was a MSD or DUI.​

This forum seems for to eager to recommend the HEI especialy the ebay junk.​

Scared??? you should be​

JeepHammer, a fellow jeeper & friend has taught me a great deal about the jeep ignition options and I can run with the best of them. I can already tell this is going to be a major pissing point with lots of :dung: to fly around. I have talked with JeepHammer and will be adding more to the tech area and pretty sure we will cover this this topic in detail.​

There is very little reason to repace the Jeep DuraSpark Distributor in a 1970s to 1981 (no calf) unit. It has the proper advance curve for our little low reving crawlers that are often under load. The advance curve in in the 1978, 79, 80 Jeep Field Service Manuals and its different for the I6, V8 and the CJ & full size jeeps for each of these engines. Take the time to plot your advance curve and pretty sure you will have 45-55 deg of total advance that will rattle your little AMC engine. The curve comes in way tooooo fast. Normal total advance would be in the 33 to 38 deg of advance total for us. If readers do not fully understand this paragraph and know how to plot and change their advance curve do not touch a HEI esp the ebay cheapos.​

I have yet to see on this forum the correct process for putting the engine at TDC and inserting the distributor. Just because it put in the same spot it was... does not mean its correct. How many readers have a #1 pos on the cap on the wrong side to make your engine work or run????​

The durspark distributor is full adjustable... it has two mech limit slots of 13 & 18 deg... OEM is set at 13 and you can get better pep and mileage if you change to 18 deg and have a healthy engine. There is a process for this and if not done correctly there will be issues. The vaccum advance is fully adjustable when it comes in at what engine vaccuum level. My distributor is 33 years old and is still working perfectly... and everyones jeep ran like mine no one would be asking for help here. I had 4 new ones in the 1970s and this runs just as well and its 33 yrs old.​

Partial list of HEI issues:
Hardened Gears... several years ago there was a need for amc gears and the market got flooded with hardned gears. This can flood your engine with hardened metal. This is true on the I6 and V8... at least on the V8 you can replace just the gear. On the I6 the gear is part of the cam shaft so you will need a new cam shaft... that means lifters too... they get changed together. Thats ahead removal the whole bit.​

So the guys that say this is a one wire change. How about the proper distributor insertion. Verify the proper advance curve. It is adjustable curve but much more difficult than the duraspark. so its realy not simple. By the way distributor insertion you need a helper to hand rotate the engine and you need a tool to verify where the #1 cylinder is and all plugs come out too... plus the process.​

HEI Gears have been cut wrong and will destroy cam gears​

HEI Shaft on HEIs have been known to be tooo long and need to be custom fit.​

HEI activates on a much lower vacuum signal and the GM has a lower vacuum too. The AMC engines were designed with a higher vacuum signal and pull in the HEI vaccum advance too quicly. Hard starts, too much advance and guys that need to disconnect the vac advance hose because it will not run with it because it has toooooo much advance. There is a std can that can retard the AMC vacuum but why bother use the duraspark​

HEI Excessive length of shafts can bind the oil pumps, no oil pres, engine failure​

HEI Shafts have broken and the mtd collars too... quality has been suspect​

HEI has several shaft diameters so it is not a simple change gear​

HEI most have alumium terminal... junk to start with and cheap​

HEI is know to ark out to the metal weights & body of distributor​

HEI is not a upgrade to the Duraspark is less of a ignition if fully uderstood. Duraspark even had a advance retard during start up.​

HEI... many solutions in past, developed a remote coil so it does not ark out to ground.​

The AMC Engine distributor mount is not made for the excessive weight of the HEI / internal coil combo and has caused failures.​

Even the DUI had a few cases of hardened gears and failres on other forums.​

QUALITY HEI's from DUI or MSD are in the $250 to $350 range... so why not just get the MSD its $150​


BOTTOM LINE>.....
Fix the weak links of the Duraspark with a few grounds and teamrush tune up parts with brass termials and premium plug wires. Proper set up it will last forever. My modual is still the 33 yr old one.​

MSD Option
For 150$ a MSD multispark ignition with 3 full energy sparks up to about 3000 rpms with the proper voltage and amperage. Up voltage aperage goes down. So saying 55,000 vots is not always a good thing on the HEI is the spark energy/amperage is so short you do not get the fire lit completely. You buy this once and done.... get that ... install it and take it with you when you sell the jeep. Put in a duraspark, use the old one, or use the HEI ignition module and keep.​

Simple.. the MSD comes with all the wires and even has a $10 adapter so you can mate to the stock distributor. So what is easier... a connector swap or a proper distributor insertion.​


All I can tell you I had a pretty good running engine and I installed a MSD. Mileage jumped 4-5 mpg and needed to adj my carb and time. I can get 23/24 mpg and never hear my engine rattle​


For the guys that need a duraspark
Cardone has rebuilt units at the auto stores with lifetime warrnaty for $50 and you can get them anywhere.​

If you have and use a Jeep Service Location they will know the Jeep OEM stuff.​


I have about 70 jeepers that have lost their cam gear from use of HEI distributor. Others have has oil pump bound up problems with major engine failures. So I guess we all have a choice. I do not have $1500 or 2000 to rebuild my engine to rebuild a engine because I was too lazy to install a MSD with a -+ voltage, two wires to coil, and a mate to the distributor connector. AND the stock suff is a back up.​

That my rant... buyer beware.​


Fred​




PS
I fixed about 10 jeeps at my home last summer, this summer bet the # double that amount. In general getting about 25-30% better performance.​

The 80 computer JEEPs have a few limitation in the properties of the Distributor. If you take out the computer and add after market carb. ..... you need to understand the short commings and correct them. You cj will run much better once these are done. Most computer vintage jeeps w/o the computer have 3 deg of mech advance. Think what that does to you advance curve.​
 
Fred,
Thanks for the help, grounded the head to the frame and battery. Spliced the wire going into the ignition module. Still no spark. I'll look at getting the teamrush upgrades and new MSD ignition.
Thanks again,
Dan
 
let us know how it goes ....
let us know if you need help with part numbers, etc.


Fred
 
Actually, I do have a question about the E core coil. Is it just a different type of coil and what kind am I looking for? I got the module and cap picked out. Thanks again.
Dan
 
I think this will copy over... this is JeepHammers info and dwg. I will try a get a pic of Ford E Coil.. I get my coils from the junk yard, they have a flat surface mtd and connector wires....... I mount to plate and hang from the stock distributor location. There are also a few oil canisters that could be used too.



If you take a close look at the diagram,
You will see part numbers for the connectors and stuff.

--------------------------------------

Distributor Adapter,

LINK: MSD Ignition 8869 - MSD Wire Adapters - Overview - SummitRacing.com


MSD Ignition 5527 - MSD Street Fire Coils


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  • msd-5527_w_s.jpg
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Ignition Coil, Street Fire, E-Core, Square, Epoxy, Red, 48,000 V, Ford, TFI, Each
Part Number: MSD-5527 More Detail …
Estimated Ship Date: Today



Ford E COIL P/N BY MANUFACTURER,
Borg Warner, P/N E-92
AC Delco, P/N F503Z
Standard Ignition, P/N FD479
Niehoff, P/N FF-179



Multiple Spark Discharge (A CDI module upgrade) gives vastly superior ignition energy on all counts. Spark Duration, Spark Voltage, and Spark Amperage. In all areas the MSD Capacitive discharge module driven ignition will out perform the Inductive ignitions in all areas, from 100 to 1,000%.
MSD is the biggest and best bang for your bucks.

The MSD 6 series units are compatible with all Motorcraft distributors and ignition coils.
The MSD 6A unit is enough for most stock or lightly modified applications. Around $135.
The MSD 6AL unit is the Cadillac of the 6 series with compatibility with all of the usual MSD timing devices, and it has a built in Soft Touch Rev Control. Around $175.
The MSD 6 Off Road, This unit is built like a tank. Epoxy sealed for water resistance and equipped with Weather Pack waterproof connectors. Around $215.



TFI COIL BRACKET
The TFI coil bracket can be salvaged off of any V-8, V-6 or I-6 engine that used it.
All Ford cars past 1986 had the TFI coil (according to the interchange book), so there
should be an abundance of coil brackets in the junkyard and parts houses.



I would like to see what cap/rotar/wire you want to buy. I am looking at my cross ref to see if I have similar. Have you decided where you are ordering all your parts from yet??
 
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Thanks for confirming my choice of coil, I was looking at the MSD Street Fire 5527. For cap/rotor I am looking at the Accel 8121. Wires I didn't think I needed to replace that they were still good.
I was also looking to do the basic MSD 6. Is it worth it to go to the 6AL?

I am not looking to purchase any time soon. We'll be leaving the Bahamas in 3 weeks, and won't be back until Nov. I'll just go without the Jeep. It's just too hard to get the items shipped here in any quick fashion. So I'll pick up the parts this summer, probably on ebay and install them when we get back. I just want to make sure I get everything I need.

Thanks, Dan
 
The main premis for the TEAMRUSH is using Premium parts, using upgrades Ford came out with in the mid 80's and apply it to our older Ford DuraSpark Ignition that is used in Jeep/AMC

Yes, MSD 6
No to Accel cap
Wires.... new TEAMRUSH cap has male terminals standing up... the Jeep OEM little cap has female top... you old wires will not fit TeamRush cap

EBAY????... I thought you wanted to buy all your parts at one spot to save shipping cost. Ebay cannot do that, not where I would buy my parts for this work.


Use the MSD made cap/rotar if you order from summit..... If they carry the BorgWarner.... that is a good cap to. I usually buy BorgWarner cap adapter, cap, rotar at Oriley They have lifetime warranty.

Summit has a good price on MSD 6, so I said if buying there get the MSD wires cut to fit, MSD coil and you have most of it in one or two spots.
 
I don't understand why people have a problem with ebay. I've bought over 500 items there and have had an issue once. Not bad odds. I can get a brand new MSD 6200 for $100 vs. Summit's $172. A lot of times you can get free shipping also. Like I said in my last thread, I'll be collecting the parts over the summer and bringing them back with me in Nov., so I don't care how many deliveries I get.
I don't beleive that you get your BorgWarner parts at O'Reilly either, they don't carry them.
Thanks for your help with my problem, I beleive I have a grasp on what I need.
 
Fred,

Can't have the module checked at Autozone as I am in the Bahamas, can't even find a replacement new or used one on the island. I'll have to have order one and have it shipped on the mail boat. So I may as well order all the parts I may need to do the upgrades.

I don't understand why people have a problem with ebay. I've bought over 500 items there and have had an issue once. Not bad odds. I can get a brand new MSD 6200 for $100 vs. Summit's $172. A lot of times you can get free shipping also. Like I said in my last thread, I'll be collecting the parts over the summer and bringing them back with me in Nov., so I don't care how many deliveries I get.
I don't beleive that you get your BorgWarner parts at O'Reilly either, they don't carry them.
Thanks for your help with my problem, I beleive I have a grasp on what I need.


Dan,

Sorry for the extra work and MY misconceptions.... Work over the internet is not always easy. My mistake when I infered your early posting you wanted to make Limited purchases and try to get it done...."get all the parts". I infered that shipping costs to Bahamas would be expensive... maybe maybe not... I would guess $30 for small items... but did not look.

Further, Much of the ref material I would like to use is on other forums and has not been posted here on Jeep-CJ.com... I and a Friend will be adding more so we can use the links and send our buds here to the tech section,print it out, and we can ans the questions. Much easier and will take up much less server space for our gracious hosts. I just do not like taking JH full article and posting it up.... sorry again.

I am a very DETAILED person and a engineer.... I miss little but not perfect nor is anyone. I buy my cap parts from Checker now purchased by ORiley in my area. I have some good guys at ORiley/Checker Savage MN. I just called, per your post.... Dan said, "they do not carry BWD"... YES THEY DO. I get many Caps/Rotar tune up parts from ORiley wires from NAPA Blue Beldins for guys I do jeep work for.... they do not like paying $80 for a pair of MSD plug wires...

Tune up Parts Ford F150, 300 I6 Engine,
Borg Warner part # & price at ORiley as of 3/3/11
Borg Warner is lifetime warranty at ORiley
Rotar D219 $5
Cap Brass Select Prem Version C193 $16
Adapter Base, buy once C193A $10.99
MSD 6200 is the MSD6a analogue good unit.... $170
GET
Std Autolite Copper Spark plugs. gap .045 vs oem .032 (only w/ all ups & grounds.)
Dielectric grease... large tube about $10
Copper Antiseize for the spark plug threads $10

I will use two wires only....JeepHammer will only use ONE the prem MSD. Last year showed JH MSD has a low price versin in Auto Stores... they did not test out well compaired to the MSD Premium version. The old price for lesser version was $80 range and dropped to $45, after I told JH he tested them. Difficult app for wire to carry 45000 V at high speed and deliver it to where it needs to be. FYI & gigllges

MSD cut to fit version for V8, you will get two sets if carefull
NAPA Dark Navy Blue Beldens for 94 Jeep 4.0, ck coil wire need female ends.... lifetime warranty

Hammer tells us too many of the store puch spark plug wires fail testing out of the box.... one of the few areas not to skimp.

I tried to help.... with your part needs. I do not want to send you to junkyardgenius, civilianjeep, JF, or any of the jeep web sites that have this info... if not needed. I gave you two stores that have great service & stock. You already stated getting coil from summit


This is a Ignition Box, std prem tune up parts, and ground assistance.
Wait all summer to get parts and I bet you forget and confuse and get the wrong parts.

Fred





Your Misconceptions..
Fred has no issues with Ebay... I use it for a tool... its a great tool....... I was trying to save your a few $30 shipping charges and time.

WOW!
Borg Warner parts NOT sold at Oriley, Fred cannot get his parts at Oriley, not sure where you looked Dan? They are still there I called because Oriely purchase lots of Checker stores... their supply contract might have changed.. so I called just for you!

I see used versions for $100 for MSD 6 on ebay, you said so I looked. Yep they are there... Ialso see them on Craigslist too. I would expect $30 ship & insurance..... so not sure how much you can save on the Summit Price of $170.

I have purchased MSD boxes local used for under $50, and will again. I use 4-5/yr. Warranty when in outback is worth something too if used. Still gamble you never know if they will work or not
 
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