Build Thread Project Scrambled - The Diesel Powered CJ-9?

[NotKewl]

Greetings, I have just planted the first seed of my new off road build. The last one was a Toyota 4Runner on tons but now I'm moving back to the Jeep side of the equation. I needed a place to document the build so here I am.

******************** WARNING! ***********************
If you cringe when sheet metal gets cut up, frames get stretched, engines swapped or generally nothing kept stock in a Jeep then be warned this thread is not for you! There will be carnage, parts will fly, but in the end it will be beautiful.
********************* END WARNING ********************

The Plan for this build...
My last off-road rig build was a purpose built rock crawler truggy with full custom tube work based on a 2002 Toyota 4Runner. First time I had ever gone that extreme with a build. The only thing I regretted with the build is not making it streetable.
This time I want a super capable off-road rig capable of hitting the hardest most gnarly trails in the US but still have the ability to take to the highway comfortably and safely at 65 MPH, AND it has to be a Jeep CJ.

The Jeep:
I am starting with a 1986 Jeep CJ7 , mostly stock. I got it FREE!!! Free is my favorite kind of vehicle (and also my favorite flavor of beer)!

• 1986 CJ7 Frame (will be stretched)
• 1987 YJ Tub (will be stretched and modified)

Drivetrain:

• Mercedes OM617.A 5 Cyl Turbo Diesel. Built with a UK spec 7.7mm M injection Pump (more more horse powers and torques), converted to serpentine belt and H.O. Alt and Trail Gear PS pump to run full hydro steering (got to steer those 40" tires easily).
• Muncie SM465 4 speed manual with granny (6.55:1) low 1st gear.
• DIY NP231 geared underdrive box(s) for triple sticks (I may stack two together meaning the Transfer Case will have more gearing options than the Transmission and a final drive crawl ratio of 1035:1 in first gear.)
• Dana 400 with aftermarket billet case built for driver drop and low 4:1 gears.
• Ford Dana 60 Snofighter front axle 3-linked with 5.38 gears and a selectable locker
• GM 14 Bolt rear axle 4 linked with 5.38 gears and either a lunchbox locker or selectable

Tires/Wheels:

• 40 x 13.5 R17 Pro Comp MT2s
• Wheels TBD - But will be forged bead locks.

The rest I'll make up as I go along, in some cases quite literally.

The Story Behind the Build:
A few years ago a guy I knew was cleaning up his shop and had a bunch of good auto parts and some guns and he said I could take them free if I just came and removed them. A year or so later I traded the guns for a beautiful 1967 F250 with a 390 FE Big Block. California truck so no rust anywhere except the pans. Only problem with the truck was it had no title (common in Georgia and Alabama). I held onto that truck for about a year until someone offered to trade me this titled Jeep and all these Jeep parts for it. I said SOLD! I owned a 1980 CJ-7 back in college and was really looking forward to building a new Jeep.

I sold most of the stock parts to help pay for the build. Dana 44 rear axle, Dana 30 front, seats, wheels/tires, etc. A lot of parts will come from my previous build, like the axles, links and heim joints for sure. I was even planning on using the awesome and reliable Toyota 5VZFE 3.4 V6 out of that build too, then I decided to go Diesel instead. I also figured I also might anger Jeep traditionalists with a Toyota engine in a Jeep (but ask me if I really care).

The FREE Jeep!


Nice dash in good condition.


Sadly the tub was too far gone all over.


The donor (Previous build)

 

[CJ]

Looking forward to following this!

 

[NotKewl]

The selected engine for this build.
1983 Mercedes OM617.A Turbo Diesel.

 

[NotKewl]

Back in December I started the tear down of the 86 Jeep CJ7 . This thing was in very rough shape. So bad I actually had to cut the windshield frame off and cut most of the tub off. I was actually afraid to stand in the tub! I tried once and my foot went right through the floor. The last guy who had this used body filler in place of actually replacing rusty sheet metal, well you can guess the rest (that's a really bad thing to do for those who are unsure of what I mean).

One entire side of the jeep tub was about 1/4 of an inch think of body filler. In one spot I measured near 3/4 of an inch with NO sheet metal behind it. The passenger side would not even let a high strength rare earth magnet stick to it. I couldn't even unbolt the fenders or the grille shell. The body mounts were so rusted they just spun when you turned them. Some pulled completely through the rest had to be cut out, including the grille. Unfortunately I have seen this before by sketchy used car dealers who quickly mask a vehicles problems and slap on a ton of Bondo and a coat of paint on it then flip it as quickly as possible to some poor unsuspecting person who doesn't know what to look for. Good trick is to take a fridge magnet with you. If it wont stick, walk away! Body filler is very useful for filling in small imperfections in bodywork and when used properly should be micrometers thin. Thin enough a magnet should at least stick.






Unfortunately the Grille hood and front fenders were useless. So, while I waited for the freezing temps and snow to go away, I turned them into a nice decoration for my foyer wall! Thankfully the wife likes Jeeps too!



It gets a nice sanding then some primer of ver the bare metal and finally Ford Engine Blue, which just happened to be on the shelf and close at hand.

Now it sits in my foyer waiting to be hung. The idea is hang it with lag bolts to hold the weight of the clip (about 50-60 lbs ish) but also make a coat hanger off the bottom.


Oh, by the way, not the first time I've used old crusty car parts to make decorations. I have a Ford 302 coffee table and this gem of a Dodge B300 van front end I salvaged and use for tool storage right now. Later I will probably turn it into a cooler. Open the hood and get a beer!


It sits in the corner of the shop right now and holds grinders and such for the time being. But enough of that, back to the Jeep!

 

[Project86]

Bastardized, my favorite kinda jeep. Give 'em hell.

 

[NotKewl]

After the nasty weather I focused on the nasty Jeep, and boy she is Naaassty (said with a Family Guy Cleveland voice, lol)

The dirty Dana 400 shot! Kids close your eyes her dirty undercarriage is exposed!



I'm thinking this was a northern Jeep. Somewhere in the rust belt where it snows 1/4 to 1/2 of the year and the salt is plentiful on the roads. I say this because this Jeep is in bad shape. As in returning to mother earth naaasssty!


The drivetrain finally out!


Bare frame, well half bare.

The axles are sold and go off to a new home.





Now to flip her over and inspect the frame bottom...


NAAAASSSSTY


OMFG!!! What frame? It had already started to warp, which explains why it was leaning to the left a little. Sigh! I poked the frame from front to back with my sophisticated high-tech metal-er-logical testing tool (a.k.a. my screw driver) and it went through in most places with just a little pressure. I'm seriously flabbergasted that this thing didn't collapse when I loaded it on the trailer!


Safe to say the frame is not useable. The engineer in me says there is nothing on this worth saving. It's just rusty scrap. So, it goes on the trailer to be recycled. But after I save those brand new looking brake lines. lol


And now I'm on the lookout for a new frame to build this Jeep... On to FB Marketplace and Craigslist!

 

[Armyvet25]

I read..."have the ability to take to the highway comfortably and safely at 65 MPH, AND it has to be a Jeep CJ" then I read the next three headings as to what you'll use, replace and....I'll be real surprised if like your Toyota build it resembles anything other than an off road buggy besides a name badge lol.
As long as it makes you happy, and you and your family have a great time, quit worrying about what others may or may not like and lose all the "you'll hate this caveat's" and build away.

 

[Armyvet25]

And like you, I've started with a mostly free CJ for my Franken build, so I'm not offended by what you do to the Jeep, but am curious as to why the Diesel other than longevity.

 

[NotKewl]

I read..."have the ability to take to the highway comfortably and safely at 65 MPH, AND it has to be a Jeep CJ" then I read the next three headings as to what you'll use, replace and....I'll be real surprised if like your Toyota build it resembles anything other than an off road buggy besides a name badge lol.
As long as it makes you happy, and you and your family have a great time, quit worrying about what others may or may not like and lose all the "you'll hate this caveat's" and build away.
View attachment 77889

LOL love the cartoon. I was part of a Jeep club here in TN driving in my Toyota, so, yeah used to just doing what I want with my builds and I never care what others think about them. This will actually be a Jeep and will retain a stock front end and tub for the most part. It will have a custom built roll cage because I'm stretching the frame and tub to be slightly longer than a CJ8 . hence Project Scrambled. This rig will mostly be trailered to events, especially long distance ones, but I want to still be able to drive it legally on the street if I need too. For like Ultimate Adventure type events or meet ups, whatever.

 

[NotKewl]

And like you, I've started with a mostly free CJ for my Franken build, so I'm not offended by what you do to the Jeep, but am curious as to why the Diesel other than longevity.

A mechanical diesel can make tons of power with just a few tweaks to the fuel and air. The Mercs are a little more difficult to tune over say a Cummins 4BT or 6BT with a P-Pump, but it can be done.

Also fuel economy, and I'd like to put in an auxiliary tank to warm and run used veggie oil (which I can get free). You have to start them on diesel then switch to veggie then back to diesel before you shut it off or the veggie oil will congeal in the fuel lines and mess all kinds of things up.

 

[Armyvet25]

Also fuel economy, and I'd like to put in an auxiliary tank to warm and run used veggie oil (which I can get free). You have to start them on diesel then switch to veggie then back to diesel before you shut it off or the veggie oil will congeal in the fuel lines and mess all kinds of things up.

sounds more like work than pleasure building this setup, and diesel economy is an oxymoron, cost vs increase mpg pffffffft.
40" off road tires at highway speeds...more of a should you not a can you.

 

[Armyvet25]

Not extremely familiar with the differences in the CJ frames, are there any other difference to expect from a CJ narrow track vs the newer wide tracks?

 

[NotKewl]

sounds more like work than pleasure building this setup, and diesel economy is an oxymoron, cost vs increase mpg pffffffft.
40" off road tires at highway speeds...more of a should you not a can you.

Very true the economy part with diesel is a moot point these days given the price of diesel. But I like diesels and never built a Jeep with one. Yeah it's a lot of work but I enjoy it so it's more like therapy for me and cheaper than a shrink. lol

 

[Armyvet25]

Shrink...the only thing they shrink is someones wallet lol.
Yeah, funny how that works, all excited up to the finish of a project, then feels like something is missing, then onto the next project.
Hoping my latest CJ project will be close to my last though, getting too old for this cold weather.

 

[NotKewl]

Not extremely familiar with the differences in the CJ frames, are there any other difference to expect from a CJ narrow track vs the newer wide tracks?

The only real difference is the size of the shock mounts up front. Older frames the mounts are tiny and the later wide tracks are much taller and beefier. They called them wide tracks because the axles were wider and they pushed the shock mounts out to compensate. Also the gas tanks got bigger and were made of plastic instead of metal. At least that's what I have observed with the two frames that I have (1976 vs 1986).

 

[Armyvet25]

I think if I was going to do something similar, rather than spend and build a custom frame or try and make one tough enough for the components I wanted on it, I'd start with an already beefy frame and suspension, example, if I build something similar and I might, a Scrambler length CJ build...I'll start with a mid 80's to 90's Bronco, body off sell and scrap, keep everything else including drive train. A Scrambler at 103 and the Bronco at 104....Voila, match made in heaven from there, stretch body, plenty of engine combos to play with, lots of aftermarket suspension/lifts etc. Why the Bronco...tougher than the Blazer/Ram Charger counter parts and not biased as I like the other two as much.
*
edit; hmmmm, got me thinking now, damn you

 

[NotKewl]

I think if I was going to do something similar, rather than spend and build a custom frame or try and make one tough enough for the components I wanted on it, I'd start with an already beefy frame and suspension, example, if I build something similar and I might, a Scrambler length CJ build...I'll start with a mid 80's to 90's Bronco, body off sell and scrap, keep everything else including drive train. A Scrambler at 103 and the Bronco at 104....Voila, match made in heaven from there, stretch body, plenty of engine combos to play with, lots of aftermarket suspension/lifts etc. Why the Bronco...tougher than the Blazer/Ram Charger counter parts and not biased as I like the other two as much.
*
edit; hmmmm, got me thinking now, damn you

Glad I got you thinking!

For what I'm doing I could buy a new frame or go all crazy and build my own from scratch (have done that in the past), but I really want a good solid starting point that is (or was) an actual Jeep CJ something. That and have you seen steel prices right now... OMFG!!!

A quick look at FB marketplace and I discovered an older (1976 in this case) jeep CJ7 frame down in GA and picked it up for a few hundred bucks. And by older, I really mean a more mature, graceful, and... and I was born in 1976 so... yeah, that greatness. Bicentennial baby!

Bronco frames are great! But more expensive and rarer, at least around here.
My suspension will be full custom built so the way I use the frame will be plenty strong for what I'm doing, besides when I stretch it I will beef it up where it needs the extra beef structurally. I'm shooting for a 110 to 116 inch wheelbase. Also why I dubbed it Scrambled CJ-9. Longer than a CJ8 so, 9. lol

 

[Armyvet25]

but I really want a good solid starting point that is.....

yeah....I read all your good starting points, right up to where you went wheeling and broke everything...axles etc
Betting a Bronco suspension can handle quite a bit.
Longer than a Scrambler wheelbase and you're right back where I said it's not even going to resemble anything CJ anymore, more like an old Jeep pickup truck, plus you'll lose a lot of maneuverability off road.

 

[Armyvet25]

Give me an old Kaiser Jeep, this thing will eat rocks for breakfast and out a condominium lol.

Hmmm, new idea, re-create old Jeep/Willy/Kaiser trucks, take some serious steel and a close truck donor, maybe start with an 80's D250 or heavier. I need to be about 20 yrs younger lol.
Got a brother born in 76...I graduated high school in 79

 

[NotKewl]

yeah....I read all your good starting points, right up to where you went wheeling and broke everything...axles etc
.... plus you'll lose a lot of maneuverability off road.

Nah, I've been on some nasty super difficult technical and tight trails all over with a flimsy little Toyota frame and never broke anything. That was with a 128 inch wheelbase. I have triple sticks which means I can put the front or rear axle in neutral anytime and do whats called a dig. Basically spin the vehicle on a dime. So at 110 to 116 inches is ideal off road (116 is Jeep JKU wheelbase), especially around here where its mountainous terrain. For hills the longer your wheelbase the more stable the vehicle. Especially when you pop up over a ledge the jeep will want to flip over backwards if your wheelbase is too short. I've seen happen many times. They just can't seem to get it in reverse fast enough to counter act the rolling motion and flop crunch.

I engineer my suspension for max travel, stability, low CG, low sprung weight, perfect anti-squat, and able to take a beating (I'm not easy on my rigs). And with the built Dana 60 front and GM 14 bolt rear chromoly axle shafts stubs and outers, you would be very hard pressed to break anything axle wise (manual locking hubs are usually the first thing to break on built axles). Especially when you are under powered. That's my wheeling tip, under power, over axle, and gears, gears, gears. When I'm done with this Jeep you can start it on a hill in gear without pressing in the clutch. Then get out and walk faster than it will crawl. That's how low the gearing will be. Like a gruffly little mountain-goat!