Which rebuild kit and Cam should I get?

[FiNorman]

So I stopped by the machine shop yesterday to discuss the rebuild of my amc 360. The machinist says the "block needs .030 over, cam bearing and freeze plugs and the crank polished. Everything else is in great shape". He hasn't gotten a chance to look at the heads. The cost for the labor is $425.
He made a recommendation for a RV cam and would like the bearings, freeze plugs, and pistons to start.

My desire is to have a motor with a throaty sound, some, but not a ton of HP, a daily driver that will rarely see the trail. It will have 33, and mated to a T-176 . I'm still not sure about what gears I have but I have a Dana 44 in the rear 30 in the front.

I looked on ebay for some kits, but they all look the same and none of them would specify what brand of pistons and other parts the kit comes with. Do any of you have a suggestion as to which kit and cam I should get?
thanks in advance

 

[Deerejeep]

Subscribed. I'm in the same boat. Only thing I can tell is the comp cam mother thumper with time etc.

 

[thiswontbetooexpensive]

The shop that did the work on my engine had all of the stuff. They sell complete rebuild kits as well. Using their stuff was the way to get the warranty.

That being said, I like to shop locally and priced out the kit that I was sold by the piece. Including the cam and all. What I could have bought locally was only $40 higher than the kit they put in.

Have your machine work done then get both the stated and micrometer measurements for the bearings and piston walls (for piston rings). There is a TON of opinions as to what is the best kind of parts to use. Don't get too bogged down in that stuff.

Metal is made better and stronger than it used to be. I would be willing to bet that the parts you are taking out lasted a long time and the majority of stuff made today will last a sufficient amount of time as well. You do get what you pay for, but keep it in reason.

 

[FiNorman]

The shop that did the work on my engine had all of the stuff. They sell complete rebuild kits as well. Using their stuff was the way to get the warranty.

That being said, I like to shop locally and priced out the kit that I was sold by the piece. Including the cam and all. What I could have bought locally was only $40 higher than the kit they put in.

Have your machine work done then get both the stated and micrometer measurements for the bearings and piston walls (for piston rings). There is a TON of opinions as to what is the best kind of parts to use. Don't get too bogged down in that stuff.

Metal is made better and stronger than it used to be. I would be willing to bet that the parts you are taking out lasted a long time and the majority of stuff made today will last a sufficient amount of time as well. You do get what you pay for, but keep it in reason.

Thanks for the advice.

I do understand what you are getting at, sometimes decision makers stress over the most minuscule of details that in the end don't have a real bearing the the end product. I just want to make sure I'm not buying something that is a huge mistake and easily avoidable.

.. when I spoke to my machinist and gave him the prices I have seen on ebay, basically between $400-800, he said that there was no way he could beat that pricing and he suggested I buy from ebay, but wanted me to get quality parts. He went through and mentioned some names he thought were quality, King Bearing, Seal Power, Molly, Egge.

He also quoted me $600 to assemble everything, and $250 to run it and break in the cam.

I actually wanted to put it together myself so that I could get into some of the guts of the rebuild.

I have heard good things about the Summit 8600 cam, but didn't know if some of the cams on the follow links are comparable... and I also had my eye on this Bulltear serpentine system to Bulltear-Online

The jeep originally has AC, so I was going to replace the components but wasn't sure which bull tear system I needed to get with that.

Again, I'm not looking for a ton of horsepower, but I would love some gettie-up when I'm coming from an on ramp.

To further complicate things I was considering fuel injection as a future upgrade so what ever I do now I would like to have compatible with my dream list.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-k8600?seid=srese1&gclid=CKmt-PjfxrcCFQ3l7AodNnYApA

The price difference between these two is $250... is there a difference in quality?

AMC V 8 360 5 9L Master Engine Rebuild Kit 1970 1991 | eBay

AND THIS


AMC Jeep 360 Deluxe Master Engine Kit RV Pistons Valves 1972 73 74 75 76 77 78 | eBay

Maybe I need to wait until he has looked at the head to see what kind of work that needs before I order those parts in the kit, but shouldn't I get everything replaced now that I have the engine out and apart?

any advice would be helpful

 

[thiswontbetooexpensive]

Personally, I would wait until all of the machine work is done to get all of your ducks in a row. IDK if there is a difference in those two kits, obviously there is something!

Also, bear in mind that most of those "kits" are actually assembled after the order is recieved by whomever does the shipping on Ebay. (Read: they don't order stuff till you do) Honestly, if i wasn't dealing with the folks working on my engine, I would have just gotten them from my Local Guy. After all this is put together, then you will know how well it is working. Hopefully your guy is standing behind his work and he sounds like he knows what is going on by what I have read here.

This is a substantial investment, and making sure all is right size wise is what you have to do make it work. This isn't a nascar engine, (Or is it?), and I would be again willing to bet that your attention to detail was not used in the original manufacture fo that engine.

As some other members signature here reads, advice garnered from the internet is worth what you pay for it...

 

[Jimbos76cj]

His builder requested the pistons, freeze plugs and cam bearing before he does the machine work. The Builder was asked about getting one of those kits and his input was as long its its a quality set of rings, bearing and pistons they are good. The kit shows King bearings which he said is good, really his only caution was that the pistons were name brand.

 

[Jimbos76cj]

AMC V 8 360 5 9L Master Engine Rebuild Kit 1970 1991 | eBay

that seems like a decent kit.. all the parts are name brand, as long as you get the name brand parts from the ebay company then your in good shape.. sorry I have not gotten the chance to get the heads to him. The after noon the rain came in arounf 1 and I forgot all about it. Ill get em dropped off on Wednesday. I would wait till he looks at the heads to see exactly what is needed. If the guides and valves are good you wont need that stuff from the big kit.

 

[FiNorman]

AMC V 8 360 5 9L Master Engine Rebuild Kit 1970 1991 | eBay

that seems like a decent kit.. all the parts are name brand, as long as you get the name brand parts from the ebay company then your in good shape.. sorry I have not gotten the chance to get the heads to him. The after noon the rain came in arounf 1 and I forgot all about it. Ill get em dropped off on Wednesday. I would wait till he looks at the heads to see exactly what is needed. If the guides and valves are good you wont need that stuff from the big kit.

Thanks Jim... no worries about the heads, and I really appreciate your effort and patience talking me through all of this.

I ran the fuel line down the left side of the rail... again great call on bending my own tubing. I will have a write up in the build forum when I'm through.

 

[OLD 9]

Consider this kit from Northern...
AMC 360 1970-1993 Engine Master Kit | Northern Auto Parts
As far as cams, I looking to upgrade the one in my 360, too. I've considered the Summit cam you mentioned but know this, Summit dosen't grind their own cams. They buy them and re-box them. You may want to read this before making a cam choice.
Chevy Xtreme Classic Chevrolet Enthusiast Forum & Web Link Directory
Notice the kits from Northern are upgradable. For $75 more you can go with a Comp Cam. I really like their Comp cam #10-202-4. I think thats what I'm going with, myself.

 

[FiNorman]

Thank you! Did you use this kit with your rebuild? We're you pleased with the components? Did everything appear to be of high quality? Did you incorporate any of the Bull Tear components into your build like the oil pump upgrade? Why are you changing cams and will you post what you chose?

 

[OLD 9]

My 360 was a fresh rebuild from the PO. I edited my post and added a little mor info. I havent used a Northern kit but they come with some good, known parts from reputable manufactures. Northern just puts them together in kit form. I have used those manufactures parts in my other builds, though.

 

[FiNorman]

My 360 was a fresh rebuild from the PO. I edited my post and added a little mor info. I havent used a Northern kit but they come with some good, known parts from reputable manufactures. Northern just puts them together in kit form. I have used those manufactures parts in my other builds, though.

Thanks!

 

[FiNorman]

Would Anyone with some experience in this area care to comment on the two camshafts that I have narrowed it down to? Basically choice #1 is Melling Grind that is repacked under Clegg, Choice 2 is the Summit Racing 8600.

The Clegg rep mentioned that he thought I might have a problem getting the Summit Racing to fit under the valve covers.



Choice #1 http://enginepro.com/downloads/newdata/EPG_CamShafts.pdf.
It is the stage 2 which is listed under American Motors further down the list.

STAGE 2
DURATION @ .050’’: 200-215 HYDRAULIC
RECOMMENDATIONS
CHARACTERISTICS IDLE QUALITY: SMOOTH
TORQUE: GOOD LOW AND MID-RANGES 1800-2600 RPM
FUEL ECONOMY: GOOD
TOWING: RACING:
COMPUTER CONTROLLED VEHICLES:
Transmission :
COMPRESSION RATIO
GOOD FOR LIGHT PULLING AND RV USE NOT RECOMMENDED
MODIFICATIONS MAY BE NEEDED
STOCK AUTOMATIC OR MANUAL 9.5:1 OR LESSSR

AMERICAN MOTORS V8, 1966-92 - Flat Tappet Cam / 290, AMC 304 , 343, 360, 390, 401 C.I. MC1786
COMMENT: GOOD AND LOW MID RANGE TORQUE AND PULLING POWER
HYD
2
204 214
280 290
.448 .472
105 105
1000-5000
SMOOTH

Choice #2 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-k8600


Brand:Summit Racing
Manufacturer's Part Number:SUM-K8600
Part Type:Camshaft and Lifter Kits
Product Line:Summit Racing® Cam and Lifter Kits
Summit Racing Part Number:SUM-K8600

Cam Style:Hydraulic flat tappet
Basic Operating RPM Range:1,500-5,000
Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift:214
Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift:224
Duration at 050 inch Lift:214 int./224 exh.
Advertised Intake Duration:289
Advertised Exhaust Duration:300
Advertised Duration:289 int./300 exh.
Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.473 in.
Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.497 in.
Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.473 int./0.497 exh.
Lobe Separation (degrees):112
Computer-Controlled Compatible:No
Lifters Included:Yes
Lifter Style:Hydraulic flat tappet
Valve Springs Included:No
Retainers Included:No
Locks Included:No
Valve Stem Seals Included:No
Timing Chain and Gears Included:No
Assembly Lubricant Included:Yes
Pushrods Included:No
Rocker Arms Included:No
Gaskets Included:No
Valve Springs Required:Yes
Camshaft Manufacturers Description:Fair idle, good low midrange torque. Largest camshaft with stock converter. Good fuel economy and towing.
Quantity:Sold as a kit.



 

[OLD 9]

The Summit cam is also reboxed, but would be my choice. Check this out
E1224PM
Elgin AMC V8 Hydraulic Flat Tappet Kits

You might like this one too. Its a little more $
CL312481-11
Howards Cams AMC V8 Hydraulic Flat Tappet KitsHowards, Hydraulic Flat Tappet Cam & Lifter Kit, AMC V8AMC V8
Adv. Duration: 269/269
Duration @ .050": 215/215
Lift: .475/.475
Lobe Center: 111 LC
1200-5200. Good idle, street, off road, towing.In Stock$185.95

 

[FiNorman]

I don't mind spending the little xtra $ if I'm getting a good value, but I'll have to admit that I understand very little about what type of cam I should get. I have tried reading some of the backround posts and doing some research, and I just when I think I might understand a little I usually find that there is another factor that influences the decision and the performance. I thought it would be a little more black and white, instead it's more like the weather.
I do know I would like a nominal performance upgrade.... maybe be able to get a little something going onto the on ramp, but I definitely don't want any vacuum problems or horrible gas mileage.
Is there a difference between the ones you thought were good and the summit? Is it true that if I use the one from summit or the ones you suggested I might have some trouble getting the valve covers or brackets to fit? do I want hydraulic or solid lifters? any difference in the Tappet
thanks again... any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[OLD 9]

Read this, I'll post more after work when I have more time.

Chevy Xtreme Classic Chevrolet Enthusiast Forum & Web Link Directory

 

[OLD 9]

The Summit cam is also reboxed, but would be my choice. Check this out
E1224PM
Elgin AMC V8 Hydraulic Flat Tappet Kits

You might like this one too. Its a little more $
CL312481-11
Howards Cams AMC V8 Hydraulic Flat Tappet KitsHowards, Hydraulic Flat Tappet Cam & Lifter Kit, AMC V8AMC V8
Adv. Duration: 269/269
Duration @ .050": 215/215
Lift: .475/.475
Lobe Center: 111 LC
1200-5200. Good idle, street, off road, towing.In Stock$185.95

The point I was trying to make here is that the Summit cam is exactly the same as the Elgin, just reboxed. I'll send you a PM with my phone number. I need to know a little more about what you are doing with the rest of your rebuild.

 

[FiNorman]

I think I have it narrowed down... I just wanted to see if I could make one final check to see if I am duplicating anything or forgetting anything that needs to be included. if I order these two kits,

Lunati AMC American Motors 256 262 Voodoo Hyd Cam Lifters Camshaft Kit 290 401 | eBay

and this:

AM360MK KIT KIT Year: 1978 Bore: 030 Rods: STD Main: STD
8 362NP STER Cast Piston 030
1 693 HAST RING SET 030
8 CB960P CLEV Connecting Rod Beari 1 MS1041P CLEV Main Bearings Sets
1 N9 DB CAM BEARING SET
1 260-1151 SP Gasket Kit
16 HA2011 TAP TAPPET DEN
1 MPE117R MEL Freeze Plugs Calculated shipping for custom parts order


Will I have everything complete? thanks again