Build Thread Rough but Ready Renegade

[BC CJ]

Hi everyone:
I’m new here and a new CJ owner. I was a CJ nut back in high school and had a rusted out 81 CJ5. It moved on long ago but I have always wanted another CJ. Recently I found an opportunity to get another CJ and I pounced! It is an early half 1975 CJ5 with all of the options found standard on a Renegade package: 304, roll bar, padded dash, rear mounted spare tire (if it was still there). The ‘Standard Catalog of Jeep’ lists these things in the options section so maybe it’s not a Renegade? Does anyone know how to tell for sure?

The Jeep makes a decent first impression.


Rolled out of the Toledo factory in Dec 1974!



My dream Jeep:
Could best be described as a resto-mod. I want to keep all of the original gear and styling cues but also like mild upgrades to help on and off road performance all in a rebuilt vehicle that is as clean and reliable as a new vehicle.
That’s the dream anyways… now back to reality! Here in reality things are a bit different: I haven’t the money, garage, tools, or skills to properly restore a vehicle. As well I want to enjoy driving this Jeep every year and, being a family man, I know that if I tear it apart it won’t see the road again for the better part of a decade or more!

My Jeep plan:
So my plan is to putter away at the edges of this Jeep, cleaning up and repairing odds and ends to make it reliable and to keep the rust at bay… er, try to slow it down anyways.
I am not particularly skilled or experienced with automotive repair or body work, I’m a back yard build kinda guy, so feel free to point out what I am doing wrong, could do differently, offer advice, or answer some of my many questions!

Thanks everyone in advance for your help; thanks for reading, or just checking out the pics!
-Darren

 

[BC CJ]

What I’ve got and where it’s going

The frame:
This frame is in excellent condition! It was one of the major reasons I decided I had to buy this Jeep. It looks strait, I haven’t found any cracks and the rust is very minimal. The front is spotless and in the back there is undercoating which I am scraping off; I want to be able to see the frame and monitor its condition in the future.


Where the undercoating was bonded well I am finding perfect, rust free surfaces underneath. Around the holes and body mounts rust has found its’ way in but fortunately it is quite minor, surficial.



The body:
The body is decent and quite solid. Most of floor is rust free but it is along the seams and in the corners where the rust has taken hold and it’s significant. It would take removing the tub to fix it properly and even then it would be a big job.


So my plan here is to remove the flakes and sand it down as best I can then paint it, maybe add the odd patch. One of the previous owners has cleaned up side panels and fenders with bondo. They did a decent job and it looks pretty good but makes it harder to see just how bad it is… might just leave that alone as long as I can.

Typical of what is under the undercoating; clean metal (looks like original paint was white) with rust along the seams and corners. I am wire brushing it as well as I can then covering it with rust paint; not ideal but it’ll have to do.



The interior:
Has been hacked. There are speaker holes drilled in the dash, numerous other switches and gauges added that don’t work now and the original seats are gone. GM seats and shoulder belts have been fabbed in… they are power seats that have actually been wired up and work… not sure what to think of that I have a rear seat out of some other Jeep to install for the kids so the interior is at least functional.



The drivetrain:
The engine starts easily and runs smoothly! It is the 304 which has been converted to run on propane. I can tell from the frame mounts that the engine has been out of the Jeep so it is possible that it has been rebuilt… who knows. My plan for now is just maintenance.


The transmission and transfer-case are suspiciously clean under there… Everything works and there are no leaks so I think they may have been rebuilt; probably new seals at least. Nothing but maintenance planned here.

The front axle looks original, no outward signs of any work done to it. The rear however is cleaner and has a chromed dif cover. Everything seems to work (open difs) so I’ll leave them alone too for now.

The electrical:
This is a rat’s nest of wires, some of which go to nowhere. Surprisingly everything works except some of the gauges and the backup lights. I want to do a fairly major overhaul of this mess one day.

The brakes:
One of the front cylinders is leaking and the Jeep came with a replacement cylinder. I would like to redo the front brakes to make sure they are tip-top. In the rear I’m happy since they are working… except for the E-brake. I want a good, functioning E-brake for safety so this will need to be sorted out.

The steering:
It was all over the road on the way home! I think a lot of the wandering is due to the tires: bald 35x14.5 boggers, 2 of which are mounted backwards.:dunno: But I will likely replace the tie-rod ends since this is fairly cheap and easy to do anyhow. The power steering works great! Even with the big tires I can turn back and forth sitting still with the palm of my hand. With this in mind I think I’ll look into ways to reinforce the tie rod and drag link; seems like a lot of force to put on those.


I think that’s about it. Now to get to work! First thing is scraping away the under coating from the whole frame and painting it. On the bottom of the tub I am just exposing the seams to clean up and paint; the undercoating is doing its’ job on the rest of the panel.

Thanks for reading, sorry it’s so long!

 

[tonkatrucksryan]

Awesome find and welcome to to the site.

 

[CJ BRIAN NJ]

hey bud great jeep i will be following along as i build mine! propane huh? i owned a e150 van that was converted to propane when i got it but i never actually got it on the road before selling it im interested to hear what you think about the propane?? is it cheap to run ? how many miles per (pound?) if thats the right term? do you plan on keeping it propane or going back to gas? what is the main reason for converting to propane?

thanks brian

 

[BC CJ]

Hey Brian,
I just got it and wouldn't have gone to the trouble of converting it myself but since it's there and running well I'll leave it alone. I haven't had a chance to drive it much. Just brought it home; I'll insure it in the summer and start finding out these details. I am interested to find out too! The main reason for propane conversion seems to be the cost: propane is cheaper. It also burns quite cleanly compared to other fuels so it may help an engine last longer... hopefully anyways

 

[CJ BRIAN NJ]

Hey Brian,
I just got it and wouldn't have gone to the trouble of converting it myself but since it's there and running well I'll leave it alone. I haven't had a chance to drive it much. Just brought it home; I'll insure it in the summer and start finding out these details. I am interested to find out too! The main reason for propane conversion seems to be the cost: propane is cheaper. It also burns quite cleanly compared to other fuels so it may help an engine last longer... hopefully anyways

i cant wait to learn more about it i think its "cool" for lack of a better word! i know most forklifts are propane so they can be used indoors without alot of noise and exhaust. there is a guy near me in jersey that has a rock buggy/crawler with a comanche cab and a complete tube chassis (its street tagged too) its got a big tank strapped to the cage in the back he did it to run a completely sealed fuel system for deep water. im wondering what it costs to convert propane cyls (20lb) are around $15 bucks to get filled , i would like to know how far you can go on a tank??

brian

 

[Project86]

One of my 86's has 33x14.5 boggers and yep it's all over the place also. I put a pair of BFG's on the front and ran down the road and it was much better. I like the looks.

 

[BC CJ]

One of my 86's has 33x14.5 boggers and yep it's all over the place also. I put a pair of BFG's on the front and ran down the road and it was much better. I like the looks.

Thanks for the input. I am really hoping it will. Further inspection also found that one side of the Jeep had significantly lower air pressure than the other. I think tires will make a world of difference for handleing and noise.

Brian, there is a great post about propane conversion in the Tech (http://www.jeep-cj.com/forums/f2/propane-conversion-tech-write-up-11396/) forum. Says there that fuel economy is similar ltr to ltr... but propane is cheaper

 

[BC CJ]

Chiseling off all of the undercoating is a BIG job. I cant wait until its done. But the good news is I am finding a lot of good metal underneath it; some rust holes too but they aren't too bad.

Here is a rear wheel well



and here is where the motor mount bolts to the frame. Good thing for the boggers, any other tire would have been blown on that nice shiny bolt! Previous owners (shaking head) I mean, really?


I also pulled some shocks off. One actually works but the others are shot. I would like to get longer travel shocks anyhow (and longer brake lines)



So far so good!

 

[CJ BRIAN NJ]

you would think the previous owner would have noticed that bolt being shiny! is there a groove in the tire from it , or just rubbed a bit when the suspension flexed? i would hack it flush with the nut or try to find a acorn nut and just trim it a bit! i guess with all that rubber in the wheel wells its hard to see anything ! im heading out to get a new grinder and some cut off wheels to start cutting the uglyness from my rear frame , my work has been picking up so i feel like im getting behind! there are 4 or 5 of us all at about the same stage with our new jeeps so its really cool to see how everyone is doing! as much as i like the east coast im really getting jealous of the mid west and western guys with so little rust! everytime i expose any steel it must be painted before i call it a night or it WILL be rusty in the morning and im 50+ miles from any salt water! there is a guy in Vegas (VegasCJ) he has his whole body down to bare metal and its fine if i did that i would be scrapping my baby in a week!!

brian

 

[BC CJ]

I have an easier solution: take the bolt out and put it through the other way. Then only the bolt head sticks out. And yeah, that bolt has dug a groove in the bogger's shoulder lugs. They are too much tire for this Jeep... plus they are so worn the measure in at closer to 33" now. I think I'll be buying 33's for it.

 

[CJ BRIAN NJ]

I have an easier solution: take the bolt out and put it through the other way. Then only the bolt head sticks out. And yeah, that bolt has dug a groove in the bogger's shoulder lugs. They are too much tire for this Jeep... plus they are so worn the measure in at closer to 33" now. I think I'll be buying 33's for it.

you are correct sir, unless there is a clearacnce issue in the motor mount and you cant get a hand in there to start the nut. i did alot more grinding last night and found some more bondo on mine will post pics later! what are you using to scrape the undercoating off of your frame? i really want (need) a sand blaster harbor freight has a decent size one for under $100 so i might grab one this weekend if i can squeeze it into the budget!

brian

 

[BC CJ]

No clearance issues, it's easy-peasy. I love CJs. Very simple design.

What am I useing?? haha, oh boy. Every odd tool I've managed to scrounge up in my poorly equipped workshop. Mostly hand tools: chisel, hammer, putty knife works good for the final scrape down/clean up. Also a wire brush and a drill with wire brush attachment. Very low tech. All I am really able to do is scrape off the undercoating and any loose rust pieces then wire down the rust until I can see some shiny metal through it. Then I brush on cheapo rust paint. Not a great plan but it is cheap and within my abilities and it will allow me to keep an eye on how the rust is (or hopefully isn't) progressing. I cant see what's going on under the undercoating, and I hate that.

I have a fair bit of bondo on the side panels. It is fairly smooth so I am going to leave it alone for now. Where holes apear inside the tub I plan to rivet-bondo on patches. A hack job yes but that where the "rough" part of this thread title comes in

 

[CJ BRIAN NJ]

No clearance issues, it's easy-peasy. I love CJs. Very simple design.

What am I useing?? haha, oh boy. Every odd tool I've managed to scrounge up in my poorly equipped workshop. Mostly hand tools: chisel, hammer, putty knife works good for the final scrape down/clean up. Also a wire brush and a drill with wire brush attachment. Very low tech. All I am really able to do is scrape off the undercoating and any loose rust pieces then wire down the rust until I can see some shiny metal through it. Then I brush on cheapo rust paint. Not a great plan but it is cheap and within my abilities and it will allow me to keep an eye on how the rust is (or hopefully isn't) progressing. I cant see what's going on under the undercoating, and I hate that.

I have a fair bit of bondo on the side panels. It is fairly smooth so I am going to leave it alone for now. Where holes apear inside the tub I plan to rivet-bondo on patches. A hack job yes but that where the "rough" part of this thread title comes in

I love it , a man after my own heart! Im a licensed general contractor (currently just exterminating , less back breaking). i have every tool you need to build a house but not so much in the mechanics tool box. im using an angle grinder , a 5" disc sander and all the other stuff on your list! last night i went to harbor freight and bought a 1/4" die grinder and a 3" high speed cutoff tool for $10 each so that should help with the tough spots. I think I am also going to leave the bondo alone where its still strong and wherever i get bare metal i coat it with $.99 cent white paint from Walmart. I also have a small 120 volt mig welder but i never used it for thin metal just heavy plate and angle iron, so im learning. I never bought tools from Harbor freight when i was building homes but for light / hobby use the air toold seem pretty amazing for the price .Im going for the 20 lb sand blaster soon , I think my compressor will run it as long as i let it catch-up. I will take pics and post later I am hoping to catch up to you this weekend! I also have a $20 HF hvlp paint gun so i think im going to paint it myself too I would really like keep the cost down . The only thing im a little worried about is the structural welding on the frame , if it doesnt look right I will hire a pro to do it to keep things safe!

sorry if i run on in your build thread but since were both just starting its helping me alot to get other peoples opinions and share my expirences! a toast to all the cj's being saved from the scrap yard

 

[BC CJ]

I worked on one of my dirt-stained and rusting steel wheels today (change of pace from scraping undercoating!) It cleaned up really nicely with the wire wheel and a sanding block/spounge. A little splash of paint tomorrow then I guess its back to undercoating. Will try to get some pics soon also.

No probs posting in my thread - I'm enjoying chatting. Thats what forums are for!

 

[BC CJ]

Hi Canadian CJ 7. I'm in Kelowna. Nice to see more CJ guys around BC for sure; we kinda get drowned out by the landcruiser fj40 crowd

tonkatrucksryan, I missed you on page 1. You've got a nice looking CJ5! How do you like the ProComps? It's one of many tires I'm considering for a 'classic' mud terrain look.


Now down to business: a project update!

Getting the E-brake to work was one of my goals early on with this Jeep and, while I haven’t checked the driver side yet, the passenger side works fine, it just needs adjustment so it will bite. Very happy about that!

The cleanup continues. I have got the passenger rear quarter done (minus 3 holes that will be patched later once I’ve had a chance to scrape at them from the interior side).


Also worked on a couple of the wheels. This is the worst one. It’s pretty rough.


After the wire wheel and a whole lot of elbow grease most of the rust is gone.


And more of my favorite: cheapo rust paint brushed on with a shot of spray paint over that to smooth out the finish It looks pretty good! I’m sure I’ll have to touch them up after a few years but oh well: paint is cheap and it gives me a reason to go work on the Jeep. (as if there aren’t enough reasons!)


I’ve also removed the old gas-fuel lines and a half dozen brackets that no longer serve a purpose. I think this old Jeep is going to cleanup nicely

 

[CJ BRIAN NJ]

"Hi Canadian CJ 7. I'm in Kelowna. Nice to see more CJ guys around BC for sure; we kinda get drowned out by the landcruiser fj40 crowd "

Hey guys its funny that fj40's are so populer up there , down here they are extremely rare ! before i decided to buy another jeep i was looking into early Box Broncs , IH Scouts , and Fj40s the first two are hard to find but the fj is damn near impossible to locate anywhere in the US. I just saw a steel hard top and "barn doors" sell for $3500 and all the glass was shot and rust was bubbling out from the pinch welds! even a total rust bucket will bring $4-5000 in my area and a whole lot more in good condition!

 

[tonkatrucksryan]

Well my jeep hasn't made it out of the garage yet so I don't know. It is camping season and we just got a seasonal site on the water for our camper and have been building and fishing so I haven't worked on my baby in over a month. Right now all the oil and bolts are out of the oil pan. I just need to separate it and fix my oil leak. Can't wait to register and drive this baby.. Can you say MUD!!!

 

[billyocup]

BC CJ - Lookin' good man! Nice to see somebody else bringing a 75 back to life. Keep up the good work! - Bill

 

[BC CJ]

tonkatrucksryan, I wont put mine on the road for a while either. It'll be hard to wait but I'll be away for a 1.5 months so not much choice in the matter. I just hope I can finish the clean-up/painting before I go so it's ready to hit the road in July!

Thanks Bill! I cant hold a candle to the job you are doing! Just beautiful your Jeep. But I think mine will look good from a car length away and it's solid; in the right condition to be well used by me

Raining today but hopefully tomorrow I'll get into the undercoating on the other rear wheel well.