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Totally different story and that would go right in. I just put a 408 (stroked 351W) which is actually bigger and just started it yesterday.
There is pretty good aftermarket support for things like motor mounts and headers which can be found at advanced adapters. In fact, building my custom headers was the hardest part. You could buy the ones they have and be done with it. The motor mounts are really nice pieces. All the accessories off the ford can be used as well. Maybe just some wiring changes.
'79 Jeep CJ7 Renegade with 304ci V8, TH400 auto, Quadratrac T-case, Stock 20 and 30 rears with no mods yet, not sure of the gear ratio.. 4" Softride Superlift, w/widetrac shock towers and 35x12.50x15 BFG Mud-Terrains
'76 CJ5, 232 ci, T-150 3-speed, D20 T-case, Corp. 20 rear w/full float axles and lockout hubs and Detroit auto locker, D30 front w/lockout hubs, gear ratio is unknown..
Not on the 4.6 idea, I kind of scrapped that one, but something came up the other day that put a twinkle in my eye.. my son asked me to go with him to look at an '86 or 7 suburban the other day, body was way too far gone for him, but it had an interesting drivetrain, 350 TBI, NP-208 and a FOUR SPEED! I wish I'd looked at the axles closer, he said it was a posi rear, but the 208 got me thinking later that it could be a 3/4 ton D60/Dana 44 combo.. he wants 400 bucks for the whole truck, so I think I may get it and put it back for a future project. What do you suppose the 4-speed gear ratio would be?? This is a factory 4-speed, had a vinyl bench seats and rubber floors, so some kind of fleet suburban...
If it's a 4 speed automatic, it's a 700R4. If it's a 4 speed manual, it's the SM465 with the 6.56:1 low range.
Front axle will be a 10 bolt in either 6 or 8 lug. The 6 lug rear would be a 10 bolt. 8 lug will probably be a semi-float 14 bolt. I think GM had discontinued the 12 bolt rear by the mid 80's. The 10 bolts would have the larger available ring gear. Something like 8.5" or 8.625" or whatever it was.
'79 Jeep CJ7 Renegade with 304ci V8, TH400 auto, Quadratrac T-case, Stock 20 and 30 rears with no mods yet, not sure of the gear ratio.. 4" Softride Superlift, w/widetrac shock towers and 35x12.50x15 BFG Mud-Terrains
'76 CJ5, 232 ci, T-150 3-speed, D20 T-case, Corp. 20 rear w/full float axles and lockout hubs and Detroit auto locker, D30 front w/lockout hubs, gear ratio is unknown..
If it's a 4 speed automatic, it's a 700R4. If it's a 4 speed manual, it's the SM465 with the 6.56:1 low range.
Front axle will be a 10 bolt in either 6 or 8 lug. The 6 lug rear would be a 10 bolt. 8 lug will probably be a semi-float 14 bolt. I think GM had discontinued the 12 bolt rear by the mid 80's. The 10 bolts would have the larger available ring gear. Something like 8.5" or 8.625" or whatever it was.
It's definately a manual, so it is probably the SM465 like you say... I just looked it up myself and found the info as well. I'm kind of excited now, they say it's a pretty strong tranny, and with that low of ratio I could stick with the 208 for now, and when the parts come available like this thing did, I could do the 203/205 doubler, like you're working on.. I think he said it had 3:73 gears in the rears, but not real sure..
This also opens up the fuel injection realm for me as well and 350s are cheap to build.. it also will have the master/slave clutch set up, so that would be an easy swap too, I would think.. how would that work, can I use a regular 4-speed pedal set, and drive the master off of that?
Connecting your clutch master to the slave on the truck might take a custom hose but that's probably about it.
The 465 from the 80's has a pretty long tail shaft. It's about as long front to rear as a 700R4. Adding a 203/205 setup may be a bit of a challenge to make it fit in a CJ. If you want to go that route, it may be easier to find a 70's era 465 that already has a short tail shaft and a 205 behind it. But certainly do your research before making big plans.
'79 Jeep CJ7 Renegade with 304ci V8, TH400 auto, Quadratrac T-case, Stock 20 and 30 rears with no mods yet, not sure of the gear ratio.. 4" Softride Superlift, w/widetrac shock towers and 35x12.50x15 BFG Mud-Terrains
'76 CJ5, 232 ci, T-150 3-speed, D20 T-case, Corp. 20 rear w/full float axles and lockout hubs and Detroit auto locker, D30 front w/lockout hubs, gear ratio is unknown..
Connecting your clutch master to the slave on the truck might take a custom hose but that's probably about it.
The 465 from the 80's has a pretty long tail shaft. It's about as long front to rear as a 700R4. Adding a 203/205 setup may be a bit of a challenge to make it fit in a CJ. If you want to go that route, it may be easier to find a 70's era 465 that already has a short tail shaft and a 205 behind it. But certainly do your research before making big plans.
This is already connected to an NP208, did you miss that? And I read that the 465 is 12" long. I'm getting the whole truck TBI 350/SM465/NP208, and then whatever the rears end up being, either way, I'm not passing it up for 400 bucks. It drives!
This is already connected to an NP208, did you miss that? And I read that the 465 is 12" long. I'm getting the whole truck TBI 350/SM465/NP208, and then whatever the rears end up being, either way, I'm not passing it up for 400 bucks. It drives!
The later 4wd SM465 has a much longer tail shaft than the earlier model. Even though the Transmission is short, the tail shaft sticks out quite a ways. There's comparison pictures in the link up there. I want to say the Transmission to Transfer Case adapter is almost a foot from front to back.
The stock 465/208 combo will work alright in a CJ7 with a slip yoke eliminator.
The problem shows up if you want to put a 203/205 assembly on the end of the long tail shaft of that Transmission . That combo is significantly longer than a 208. It will push the output yoke on the Transfer Case very close to the axle. You'll have to consider that when putting it all together.
The long tail shaft of the later 465 doesn't work well with the very long 203/205 combo in a short wheelbase Jeep. Keep in mind that the 203 adds about 9" to the 205, which is not short front to back either. All of that comes out of the driveshaft length.
Am I saying "don't do it"? No. I'm just making sure you know what to expect when you start looking into the 203/205 swap with that Transmission .
You can drop some money into the 465 and get a short tail shaft kit with a new adapter. It's not cheap but it cuts most of the length off the tail shaft which will give you the room you need for the 203/205. You can also do an XJ spring swap like I've done that pushes your axle 8-9" back, giving you lots of room for whatever drivetrain you want. You can do both and have way more than enough room.
Or, you can run the stock 208 and figure out that with the granny low first gear you don't really need the doubler and don't want to waste the time or effort in squeezing in the 203/205. You might figure out that after you spend everything on getting the 203/205 to fit, you can spend the same money on an Atlas that gives you a 4.3:1 (close to the combo low of the 203/205) and it will bolt right up with no real effort.
Whatever you choose, it's good to know what your long term goals are and what it will take to accomplish them. I'm just trying to point out one potential major pitfall that you can run into with that combo in the short wheelbase Jeep.
'79 Jeep CJ7 Renegade with 304ci V8, TH400 auto, Quadratrac T-case, Stock 20 and 30 rears with no mods yet, not sure of the gear ratio.. 4" Softride Superlift, w/widetrac shock towers and 35x12.50x15 BFG Mud-Terrains
'76 CJ5, 232 ci, T-150 3-speed, D20 T-case, Corp. 20 rear w/full float axles and lockout hubs and Detroit auto locker, D30 front w/lockout hubs, gear ratio is unknown..
Ok, gotcha... I actually saved that link the other night, but just hadn't had a chance to read it all yet, lol.. I doubt I'll do the doubler 203/205 then, this sounds like a pretty good swap just like it is.. I may look into the rear XJ spring conversion though, that sounds interesting, then I can bob my rear fenders! This is gonna be fun, I need to read up on the XJ springs now...
'79 Jeep CJ7 Renegade with 304ci V8, TH400 auto, Quadratrac T-case, Stock 20 and 30 rears with no mods yet, not sure of the gear ratio.. 4" Softride Superlift, w/widetrac shock towers and 35x12.50x15 BFG Mud-Terrains
'76 CJ5, 232 ci, T-150 3-speed, D20 T-case, Corp. 20 rear w/full float axles and lockout hubs and Detroit auto locker, D30 front w/lockout hubs, gear ratio is unknown..
That's pretty cool, I like it, how do you go about ordering springs? Say I have a 4" lift, do I order 4" XJ springs? I'd like to see an install, I have been day dreaming all day about chopping up my fenders, buying a tubing bender...:drool:
That's pretty cool, I like it, how do you go about ordering springs? Say I have a 4" lift, do I order 4" XJ springs? I'd like to see an install, I have been day dreaming all day about chopping up my fenders, buying a tubing bender...:drool:
I'm working on a SOA setup so I used stock springs in the rear to compliment the stock YJ springs with the shackle reversal in the front. The Jeep does sit somewhat close to level but I haven't finished everything so I may tweak things a little as I get closer.
The tube fenders from BTF are a SWEET deal. If you already have a tubing bender, "maybe" you could save some money. But yours won't be as nice. You can have them to your door for $200 and just weld them after you've bolted them on.
'79 Jeep CJ7 Renegade with 304ci V8, TH400 auto, Quadratrac T-case, Stock 20 and 30 rears with no mods yet, not sure of the gear ratio.. 4" Softride Superlift, w/widetrac shock towers and 35x12.50x15 BFG Mud-Terrains
'76 CJ5, 232 ci, T-150 3-speed, D20 T-case, Corp. 20 rear w/full float axles and lockout hubs and Detroit auto locker, D30 front w/lockout hubs, gear ratio is unknown..
The tube fenders from BTF are a SWEET deal. If you already have a tubing bender, "maybe" you could save some money. But yours won't be as nice. You can have them to your door for $200 and just weld them after you've bolted them on.
I know what you're saying, but who says mine won't be as nice? I have access to rigid benders, I'm an electrician by trade and have been bending conduit for nearly 30 yrs. I'm not doing it myself to save any money, I'm doing it because I can, and I plan on building several more Jeeps, once I get my shop built, and maybe turn it into a business... we'll see. I want the flexability to design what I want and build it how I like it, not be conformed to what's available on the market...
I liked the ones from BTF to , but if your gonna make some up and possibly turn it into a business its time to get to work. I for one would like to see them. Id like something that comes out over the tires to satisfy Pennsylvanias finest.
I know what you're saying, but who says mine won't be as nice? I have access to rigid benders, I'm an electrician by trade and have been bending conduit for nearly 30 yrs. I'm not doing it myself to save any money, I'm doing it because I can, and I plan on building several more Jeeps, once I get my shop built, and maybe turn it into a business... we'll see. I want the flexability to design what I want and build it how I like it, not be conformed to what's available on the market...
Sorry man, I'm sure you can make yours as nice. I just had so much going on so time was a factor. I think I would have spent AMC 150 on the metal. Its a ripoff here in CA.
These fabbers amaze me: $300 for a tube and a couple of hangers???? Outrageous. And for what it is worth XJ springs are considered too weak for anything serious by XJ people and are not good swap candidates.
If you are redoing the rear you can save yourself a couple of hundred bucks over the BTF "kit" listed above. Purchase the hangers from Barnes or RuffStuff ($32 a pair Flush Mount Shackle Hanger Barnes4WD.com - Off Road Fabrication Parts plus much cheaper shipping) and then source some longer junkyard leaf springs with an off-set center pin like from an F150 or similar. You still have to comp cut the corners but this moves your axle back, increases articulation, and can be done for well under half the cost of the "kit" even after sourcing replacement springs & spending $35 at the steel yard for some C-channel to reinforce your rear crossmember .... remember that "kit" does not include leaf springs!
'79 Jeep CJ7 Renegade with 304ci V8, TH400 auto, Quadratrac T-case, Stock 20 and 30 rears with no mods yet, not sure of the gear ratio.. 4" Softride Superlift, w/widetrac shock towers and 35x12.50x15 BFG Mud-Terrains
'76 CJ5, 232 ci, T-150 3-speed, D20 T-case, Corp. 20 rear w/full float axles and lockout hubs and Detroit auto locker, D30 front w/lockout hubs, gear ratio is unknown..
I liked the ones from BTF to , but if your gonna make some up and possibly turn it into a business its time to get to work. I for one would like to see them. Id like something that comes out over the tires to satisfy Pennsylvanias finest.
That's one of the things I've noticed about alll the tube fender sets, they only come out from the body a few inches. Anyone with full width axles and a tire bigger than 35" can't get any coverage from most of the sets out there. Do they just need to cover on the top side of the fender in PA? All the kits you see taper out to the top and then back in to the body...
Sorry man, I'm sure you can make yours as nice. I just had so much going on so time was a factor. I think I would have spent AMC 150 on the metal. Its a ripoff here in CA.
These fabbers amaze me: $300 for a tube and a couple of hangers???? Outrageous. And for what it is worth XJ springs are considered too weak for anything serious by XJ people and are not good swap candidates.
If you are redoing the rear you can save yourself a couple of hundred bucks over the BTF "kit" listed above. Purchase the hangers from Barnes or RuffStuff ($32 a pair Flush Mount Shackle Hanger Barnes4WD.com - Off Road Fabrication Parts plus much cheaper shipping) and then source some longer junkyard leaf springs with an off-set center pin like from an F150 or similar. You still have to comp cut the corners but this moves your axle back, increases articulation, and can be done for well under half the cost of the "kit" even after sourcing replacement springs & spending $35 at the steel yard for some C-channel to reinforce your rear crossmember .... remember that "kit" does not include leaf springs!
I've been looking at four links and coil overs or air shocks, you can pretty much put the axles where you want them, and your center of gravity is much lower. The shocks are big money though... but the up side is that the ride hieght on 40s is about the same as my 35s and 4" leafs.. been leaning pretty hard that way. It kinda gets you looking like a buggy, but I've seen a couple rigs that still keep the CJ look with minimal body mods that look pretty BA, and, you get that 100"-110" wheel base you've always wanted!! And you can doo it all with a simple investment into a tubing bender...
