Build Thread 82 CJ7 frame swap & lift build

[tarry99]

I hate to make one more comment but if it was me since your going to have the pan and timing chain off I would have that crank micro-finished just to polish off any rough spots. That process takes maybe a tenth or two of a thousand off.

 

[PaRenegade]

Yep, that's how it starts. "I just going to do this.....". I wasn't initially planning on a valve job, but once I seen the stems.... I wasn't going to do the timing chain and sprockets, but since it was tore down this far....

My rear main wasn't lookin' all young and spry either, but that's for another time when I can do the crank, all the mains, the rods, and the rings. I don't know if it's a good idea for you to just do half of the rear main. The existing one is seated and worn to the crank. Here's the catch22 issue with that. If you do one main bearing, they should all be replaced. To do that the crank has to be removed. And since the crankshaft bearing caps and the rod caps are off, you might as well replace the rod bearings too. While the crank is out you should take it to the machine shop to have it cleaned up and/or ground, in which case they should supply you the bearing to fit. this is also the time to examine the cam and maybe replace it. See how it snowballed? It's always cheaper, in the long run, to do it now once time and labor is factored in.

Here was my old timing set:

And here's the new: (much tighter and shinier)

 

[rbagley]

It's best to plastigage them since you can't mic the crank. It may have a reground crank. The bearings should also be marked if they are oversize.

I bought a Jeep that had been rebuilt by a pro shop and they put STD bearing on a reground crank. Good for me, it went cheap. Too bad for PO.

Pretty easy to Gage them.

73CJ- you saved me a huge headache with the above comment. I went ahead and bought the bearings, started taking the caps off again and came across the stamp .001 on the bearings- the new ones that I bought were stamped STD.
I was thanking & praising you out in my garage for taking that time to post your comment on my blog because it really helped me out.

I was going to leave the motor alone until the next phase anyway so I put the oil pan back on and hopefully will not add anything else to the motor until it is all back together. It ran before the restoration- I'm just hoping I haven't made anything worse messing with it.

When I save up a little more money I will completely & properly rebuild it (w/a 4.0 head?) or maybe the AMC 304 that I have. By then I may have something else in mind.

 

[rbagley]

Yep, that's how it starts. "I just going to do this.....but since it was tore down this far....

Here's the catch22 issue...If you do one main bearing, they should all be replaced. To do that the crank has to be removed. And since the crankshaft bearing caps and the rod caps are off, you might as well replace the rod bearings too. While the crank is out you should take it to the machine shop to have it cleaned up and/or ground, in which case they should supply you the bearing to fit. this is also the time to examine the cam and maybe replace it. See how it snowballed? It's always cheaper, in the long run, to do it now once time and labor is factored in.

I started messing with the motor and need to leave it be for that very reason. It is not its time YET. I started replacing stuff on it and would rather do it all or nothing at all.

My priority is to get the Jeep back together, hope the motor still runs at least as well as it did when I tore everything apart and drive it around for the summer working a lot of the kinks out. Once I get myself out of the hole ($$$) I can then work on whatever motor I decide to do and do it right.
This whole project started on a $400 Jeep that I was just going to put a lift on, repair the rear frame sections and clean up and paint stuff as I go.

Yeah, I am going to be tickled when it is finished because it is going to be way nicer than I ever imagined- but I never intended all of this- new frame, fiberglass tub, powder coated brackets and new parts everywhere.
It is getting more fun as I get closer to getting the body painted and the Transmission & Transfer Case bolted up to the motor. I can almost see the light at the end of the tunnel, but know that even when it is all together, some of it will need to be tweaked and the next phases planned out.

 

[PaRenegade]

I hear ya man. I'm waiting another couple years to rebuild the engine completely, provided it lets me and I didn't screw anything up. I wasn't planning on replacing the timing chain set yet or finding a cracked piston. Otherwise it would have been some gaskets, frieze plugs and paint, then done for now!

 

[rbagley]

It has been just over 2 months since I posted my last update. Thankfully, I have gotten a lot accomplished since then- although not as much as I had hoped. (get your popcorn ready because I have a lot of updates to make)

I left off with the timing chain replacement... (by the way- this probably isn't the post you want to follow when replacing yours ).

I hoped to just take the bolt off of the bottom gear and slip the new chain in the same spot. I am still unsure if all of this was supposed to take place with the #1 piston at TDC. In the manual, this was noted for the V6 & V8, but did not say for the I6.

The smaller gear had two marks on it, which complicated things for me (see the picture) & the new chain was smaller (not as stretched out) so it didn't go on without moving one of the gears a touch.

[side note- Years ago I changed a head and timing chain on another car and found out when it was back together that it was 1 tooth off so I knew I didn't want to make that mistake again.]

At this point I am just hoping that based on the tips in my manual, I can be assured that they are lined up properly. The manual said "on in-line six-cylinder engines, with the camshaft sprocket timing mark at the 1 o'clock position, the timing marks must be 15 pins apart."

I had the pins 15 apart and then cranked the motor around to make sure dots lined up and used a red thread to see if they lined up exactly (see picture).

I proceeded to put the oil slinger back on, installed a new oil seal in the timing chain cover and then attached the cover to the engine with a new gasket and the appropriate sealant.

In the end, I only had to move one of the gears slightly to get the new chain on, then made sure I was 15 pins away and still had the dots lined up (they looked darn close). I guess I will see how it went later on......

 

[rbagley]

As I have mentioned before, this build started as a plan to lift and fix some stuff and go wheeling. It has turned into an almost complete restoration which means that I have been replacing so many more things than I had ever intended to.

I have been sandblasting, powder-coating, replacing worn out parts and putting a lot of stuff back together in between working on the body panels.

I picked up a new "lower steering boot shaft kit" for the end of the steering shaft and greased it up and put it back together.

I also picked up a new throw-out bearing, clutch linkage kit, and a clutch fork boot among other things.

 

[rbagley]

I decided to loosen up the budget and hook the Jeep up with the goodies that I want (to an extent). I could not bear to put the old seats, seat belts and steering wheel in. They were in desperate need of replacement.

I bought the LED tail lights and side markers that I liked, as well as picked up replacement stuff like shifter knobs & inserts, a wiper motor cover and stuff for the dash (plastic gauge cover, dash lamp set, steering column cover, and control cable set).

Flashy is just not me, so while many things are getting replaced, none of them will be chrome, and a lot of stuff is just new replacement OEM looking. I hope to have everything looking simple, nice and clean when it all goes back together.

I did get the Corbeau Baja JP seats for the front with 4 point harnesses and waiting for a while before I get the matching rear seat. The seats and harnesses supposedly bolt into the factory spots, so I am anxious to see if that is really the case.

The (15x8) American Racing Black Wagon Wheels on the Jeep are off an old Ford I had for a short time- since they are still practically new looking I bought a fifth and had the spare tire mounted.

Finally, in the last picture are a set of tire deflators that my buddy gave me. We frequent Silver Lake Sand Dunes (MI) and rather than go around to each tire deflating and checking pressure, you screw one of these on to each stem and they automatically take the pressure down to what you have set. Being that we go to Silver Lake the most, I am not as worried about the Jeep getting too beat up soon after I get it all painted. There are guys with stuff a lot nicer than what I will be taking up there.

You can see the grille primed in the background of the spare tire picture...more about that in my next post.

 

[rbagley]

I had a guy come out and give me an estimate on painting my Jeep on the side. He painted for a living and since I had no idea (of what people charge) I asked him to give me a ball park if I were to take everything off and bring in the parts stripped (grille, fiberglass tub, both fenders, hood and fiberglass windshield frame).

$3000 he tells me as my jaw hit the ground. I looked into Maaco after that, but if I did all the prep it was still going to be $1,250 minimum out the door for a base-coat clear-coat. I wasn't thinking there was much paint needed for the exterior of the parts that I listed above, so I couldn't believe they wanted that much to paint it.

Since then, I have proceeded to prep everything myself and get it ready for paint. My mind is made up to do a base-coat clear-coat (silver/light gray). I have the experience to fill/sand/prime and the time to do a good job with the prep, but don't have the equipment or experience painting (other than rattle can).

I went ahead and bought the materials (came out to be just about $500)($135/qt for Dupont brilliant silver base coat color) and then all of the other stuff needed (sealer, clear & activator and base reducer).

My wife's uncle is retired and was willing to help me "get started" so I came with everything but the tub ready to go and it sounds at this point like maybe we will take it one panel at a time when he gets back from vacation. I may still look into getting estimates now that the body work is almost complete.

I sandblasted the fenders & grille and had them powder-coated so that I would have a solid and somewhat durable "undercoat." Post powder-coat, I filled small pits and dents, primed them and sanded down to a 400 grit once everything was near perfect. (I haven't taken any pictures of it all primed- y'all know what that looks like anyway).

 

[rbagley]

The tub was in pretty good shape. Once I took everything off, I mostly just had some small holes to fill (from the top and the trim along the side).

I used Bondo hair (for small fiberglass repairs) to fill the holes on the inside and out. It is a little harder to work with than regular Bondo spreading and also sanding. I also bought a fiberglass repair kit that I am going to use to beef up the front body mount locations (they were both cracked).

I was able to use the left over from a Bondo Truckguard Roll-on bed liner (my buddy and I had some from doing the back of his truck) to coat the front of my firewall and additionally I bought a gallon of Herculiner to put on the inside of the tub after the body gets painted. I am also considering putting the Herculiner over the top rails of the tub just so that it will be more durable where people will tend to step in or where a top would sit.

I still have to "add" a little fiberglass to the corners of the gas filler insert. When it was bolted on there was sunlight coming through in a couple of the corners from where the PO had cut. I will then prime the rest of the tub, sand and fill what ever I missed so that it is ready for paint (even if paint isn't ready for it).

 

[PaRenegade]

Lookin' good. Ought to be done next week right...
I'm on the body repair stage now and it's taking forever it seems. The heat doesn't help, seems to slow my movements and lengthen liquid break times.

 

[rbagley]

Ought to be done next week right...

Yeah- It was supposed to be done LAST week. Around May I was determined to finish July 13th for a small town car/truck show at the local park. The closer I got to that date the further it seemed from being done. I've stopped worrying so much about when it is going to be done. No more deadlines...but I hope to be done by the end of August so that I can drive it on the first day back to school :drivingI am a phys ed teacher).

I began the process a couple of weeks ago of pulling the dash and finally have everything off of it so that I can sand it down and paint it at some point. The dash is in decent shape...just a couple of rust spots where the dash pad was covering. I am still debating on whether or not there will be a radio in this Jeep. I have a CB to put in, but not sure about a radio. I bought the replacement black dash cover without a radio hole, but it would be easy enough to cut out if I decide listening to the I6 just isn't cutting it.

I cut the 4" holes for my taillights tonight- they look kind of big on there, but I am going to stick with them. They are a combination of stop/turn/back-up and don't stick out as much. There are not a lot of things I am doing to change the looks, but this is one of them.

In the process of cutting 2 larger holes for the new tail lights I got rid of about 12 smaller ones. I also sanded down some of the fiberglass patch I put in the corners of the gas filler hole and mounted that temporarily to see how it turned out. I am anxious to get it painted but still have a few solid days worth of prep if I want to make it happen. I keep putting it off even though it is what I would like to get done the most.

I am going to miss the look of the original tail gate but plan to mount a spare tire over the back bumper so it will be covering the back end any how. It is going to look so much better than it did when I got it regardless.

 

[PaRenegade]

Your not alone. I've moved my finish date from originally this month, to September and now to next May. The body repair is dragging.

 

[maos84cj7]

Enjoying your build... Reminds me of mine as I ended up swapping frames and all the rest of it too... Cherish the build, I miss it. Not that driving it this summer hasn't been sweet! You're almost there....

 

[rbagley]

I got a number of things back that I had powdercoated, so I have been re-assembling a lot of stuff lately as well as cleaning up and painting a few things that I could not sandblast & powdercoat.

It is tough knowing what to do with the brake booster / master cylinder since the brake fluid will eat up the paint if any gets on it. I painted it anyway and we will see how long it lasts.

I definately don't intend to build a show Jeep but it is nice to have everything cleaned up when assembling and I hope the powdercoat keeps the rust away for a long time into the future.

Tough Coat is the company I use. The guy charged me $AMC 150 to do everything you see in the first picture. Somehow I have made room in the budget for a number of batches like these.

 

[rbagley]

The fiberglass tub I bought came with an extra gas pedal assembly- which came in handy when trying to figure out how to put the plastic pedal back on. There is a spring and pin that I was having difficulty with until I saw the other one. It is a wonder how this Jeep will ever get back on the road safely when things like that slow me up.

I tried to replace the disintegrating rubber boot on the booster but was told that more than likely I can only get one with a new booster and that it could not be found separately.

Pics below just show the before & afters (or vice versa). I think because I don't have the body painted yet I spent more time on the details than I would have. If the body was done I would have hurried a little more to get it all assembled and running and may not have cleaned up/painted a lot of the stuff that hides behind the dash or under the hood.

 

[rbagley]

I spent part of the day putting the seat brackets on and test fitting them in the tub. 6 of 8 holes lined up from the PO's mounting locations but my new Corbeau seats lean back so much further than the stock ones. Is anyone here using Corbeau seats on stock CJ brackets and find a solution? They are supposedly direct bolt on.

My cousin said that it makes it look like I am hauling and being thrown back in the seat. I don't think that is going to happen with 2.73 gears and the original I6. I still need to figure this out, but may wait until the steering wheel is in to see how much straighter up I am going to want to sit.

The drivers side seat bracket was shorter than the passenger to allow a slider between the seat and the seat brackets. I don't know if this was a stock option or not, but it will be nice to be able to slide the seat back, or forward if someone with short legs takes it for a spin. My wife is 5'11 and has longer legs than I do, so that will not be the case for her.

Side note- if I ever finish this project I am going to try to get my wife in the Jeep Chix section of JP magazine. She is somewhat of a conservative girl so she wouldn't let me send in a pic of her on the hood in a bikini, but maybe in a pair of jeans and a cowgirl hat.

Back to the Jeep. I put the tub on for a test fit and got really excited to see how high it is going to sit. I am not sure how well the body mount locations are going to line up, though. They were close, but it almost looked like the tub was meant for something else. The rear mounting locations were definitely not going to work where the original mounts go. I will worry about that a different day though.

 

[rbagley]

One of the things I did that I was regretting for a while was take the entire steering column apart. I was hoping to get everything completely stripped so that I could powdercoat certain parts of it but I could not get the two tubes separated because there is some type of plastic pressed? between them. I ended up just wire wheeling and painting the tubes with a can of rustoleum...I guess I know now how to take it all apart, but I have yet to reassemble. We will see how that goes.

My neighbor taught me how to get the rest off after my last picture- There was a medal ring that had to be exposed by pushing the face back. I was then able to spread the ring enough to get behind it with another screw driver to pop it off. I am hoping to find a new ring since I pretty much wrecked this one getting it off. I have a new steering wheel waiting to be put on once everything is back together.

I didn't take any more pictures because my neighbor was there and it was coming apart pretty quickly after that.

The dash is ready for paint now as well. Before I began working on it I contemplated just buying a new one to save myself 10 hours or so, but I am so far over budget and I couldn't justify another $200 for something that was easy enough to fix. There were a couple of rust holes that I put fiberglass hair on from the back and then front to patch and after sanding you cannot tell they were ever there. There were dents and other spots to fill and sand and then primed/sanded a couple of times more.

 

[JAG811]

One of the things I did that I was regretting for a while was take the entire steering column apart. I was hoping to get everything completely stripped so that I could powdercoat certain parts of it but I could not get the two tubes separated because there is some type of plastic pressed? between them. I ended up just wire wheeling and painting the tubes with a can of rustoleum...I guess I know now how to take it all apart, but I have yet to reassemble. We will see how that goes.

Looking good mate.

The steering tubes are designed to collapse in an accident. That's why they're pressed together like that.
I've seen them separated and then tacked back but I'd be keeping the plastic there and it sounds like you've done a great job

 

[Rippin]

Wow, love your build! I can't believe how similar it is to how I'm going to do mine. gonna start on mine next summer. Picked up a nice rust free frame for AMC 150 last month, and ive started ordering small parts here and there so i can space out the expense over time. Gonna make my wife read through your build so she can get an appreciation for exactly what I have in mind, because this is it.

In reading through your posts I noticed the spring perches before you mentioned them. I had to do mine not long ago, they had collapsed so badly that the axle was rotating about 30-40 degrees every time i let off the clutch. it had a ridiculous clunk, and i didn't figure out what it was until my wife was driving the jeep one day and i was following her and i saw the axle trying to twist out from under the jeep lol