Motor timing 180* out?

[Lumpy Grits]

I just stumbled upon this thread and it piqued my interest. After I put my rebuilt AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l in, I went to time it and the timing mark on the balancer was 180 degrees off. The engine runs fine without any backfiring, so I left it alone and have been driving it that way for a good year or so. Is it possible that an engine can run fine with the timing 180 degrees off? Would it cause any damage? I believe my rotor is pointed toward the #1 plug wire, but I'll have to double check.

You sure that the HB hasn't 'spun' to show this?
It's not uncommon for the rubber mount in the HB to do this.
LG

 

[Turbogus]

Welcome tothe thread Dolamite, in my case this wasn't the issue, I wish there was a way to change the title of these threads so to cut confusion

 

[Dolamite]

You sure that the HB hasn't 'spun' to show this?
It's not uncommon for the rubber mount in the HB to do this.
LG

I put a new harmonic balancer on when I put the engine in. I suppose the mark could have been in different place. Wish I would have kept the old HB to compare the location!

 

[Turbogus]

Since my experiences with Jeep parts for 'BB' that are available these days I'm dubious about the quality of Chinese foundries and assembly plants.

 

[Turbogus]

In case you didn't know what a 'Black Stallion Carter AFB looked like;





...got the new smaller jets in and will be testing this week, I'm hoping

 

[Turbogus]

Incidentally, I got the new 0.090 primary and 0.089 secondary jets installed and the AFB is all together again, but I'm a little gunshy to try this all again....

 

[Turbogus]

A new wrinkle on this, I hadn't had time since my last post to even start the motor since those new, much smaller jets went in. Even smaller than what was in it before the float sank last summer. One of my two day off per year, Thanksgiving I headed out to the garage and with all the foul outs I've had and expecting more of the same I was surprised to find after getting fuel to the carb it idled smoothly. I let it run for about two or three minutes before shutting it off (up 'till now the plugs would've fuel fouled) and pulling the no. 1 spark plug it was clean with just a couple of tan spots on the ceramic surrounding the electrode.
Going to try it again on Saturday (1/2 working day) fill 'er with fuel and check the timing....... IF all goes well.

 

[Hedgehog]

You have patience sir. I would have at least tried it in the neighborhood before shutting her down.

 

[Lumpy Grits]

You have patience sir. I would have at least tried it in the neighborhood before shutting her down.

Me too
I don't 'wait-well'
LG

 

[Turbogus]

Well, it's not so much a matter of patience, than a matter of free time. (7 day working week) not quite back to square one, tried starting 'BB' and after a tailpipe 'bang' she started up and idled. I let 'er run for about 5 minutes (with the same occasional bang) with the double garage door open as well as the back door but it became too much anyway, had to retreat to the front yard. Pulled the no. 1 plug and it was fuel fouled again, but to a very noticeable lesser degree than before.
I'm confident of the float settings as I was using those new digital calipers, and as such I feel it must be something else with this carburator. I've verified ignition and it wouldn't run at all if there was a fault there, and I refuse to believe that this carburator is 'just a bad carb that should be junked' as it ran for over three years without any trouble until that sunken float and the throttle shaft leakage since fixed. What's more since my income is not very good I can't budget for a new carb of any kind, be it Edelbrock, Rochester or Holley.

 

[Turbogus]

With prompting from other forums I went ahead and started rechecking my ignition system. It was remarked by many that the Motorcraft Module is garbage butit's served me well up until now, I even have that same EEC 1 box in my '81 Ford van and it's never failed. I checked the resistance of the spark plug wires (NOS Accel carbon core) and they all checked out to be within limits for their length, however I found a gremlin had swapped out the no. 2 & 4 spark plug wires which more than likely accounts for a backfire when I most recently tried running the motor. It's been remarked that I should invest in; a MSD 6 module $200+ a set of spiral core plug wires $60+ and updated cap and rotor $100+. The trouble is in these times, despite my wishes I cannot budget for this kind of gear, no matter how attractive for best running and so forth. So I'm going to reroute the even bank of plug wires over the radiator hose as this was pointed out to me, then try the motor again.

 

[Hedgehog]

Are you saying that the #2 and #4 plug wires were on switched? If so switch'em back. You aren't running a high compression hot rod so normal wires should be fine. With the plug wires on the correct plugs, how does it run?

 

[Turbogus]

When I saw that the other day I shook my head at myself. The carb was off of the motor and I'm in the process of re-mounting it. Curse my 7 day work week, each night when I come draggin' in I'm such a zombie I just want to eat dinner and go to bed.

 

[Turbogus]

Well, last night I had a headlight failure on one side so when I came draggin' home in this normal deluge of rain and wind the PacNW is infamous for, I got the carburator mounted up and all the vacuum lines and fuel line hooked up. Also I rerouted the even bank of spark plugs over the top of the motor, and twisted up the distributor wires and sip tied them to stay that way. I'm hoping this'll get this substandard ignition working properly. May try a startup on Saturday so I'm not working in the dark (what with the PacNW overcast it gets dark pretty early)

 

[Hedgehog]

This time of your everywhere gets dark pretty early! We are about to turn a corner with the days getting longer or the sun setting later in the day.

 

[Lumpy Grits]

Don't 'wrench' when tired-The possible 'cost' is way to high.
LG

 

[Turbogus]

I hear ya LG, but I really have only Limited free time, which is why this service/repair has taken so long.

 

[Turbogus]

Okay, after taking care of the 2 & 4 plug wires and moving their location to over the intake manifold, and I finalized the carburator and finally a week later I started it up this morning and after getting fuel from the tank to the carb, it idled smooth and strong. No bucking or backfire and no smoke from the tailpipeIf thing work well tonight I'll set the timing and recheck the no. 1 spark plug.

 

[Turbogus]

Went to check the base timing then dynamic (didn't get that far) and with the dampner mark on TDC the rotor was pointed at 6 o'clock. roughly at No. 3 terminal. I think I'm having to re-orient the distributor.

 

[Hedgehog]

No you really don't. Just stick a light on it and see where your timing is right now. Then set the thing to the proper timing. The rotor doesn't need to actually point at cylinder #1, it needs to be pointing at the plug wire post leading to cylinder #1. If the engine runs at all you are close enough to set the dynamic timing. Static timing is for a new engine that you are attempting to get close, dynamic timing is the way to go on a running engine. You don't need to put any more mechanical operations between you and a running Jeep than is absolutely needed.