Wiring Orangey Electrical

[jeff_b]

Hi everybody, I respectfully request some feedback on Orangey the new-to-us 1970 CJ. With all due respect to the PO back in the day...the wiring looks like a deranged possum went on a bender in the 1980s and hacked an old-school glass fusebox in. Believe it or not, it supports a small block Chevy w/HEI, tilt power steering column, electric fan, and klaticky klack out back. The rig starts, runs and drives pretty good, but the electrical is hurtin' for certain. Does anyone recognize this fuse panel?

Additionally, any advice on rewire kits is appreciated. I've looked at the Painless kits, but I'm undecided on whether to rewire it like a CJ, or a Chevy pickup. Thanks, have a great day!

 

[TSB8C]

'75-'78 CJs used a fuse block with glass fuses. After '78, you got ATO fuses. Pre-'75, those early CJs didn't have fuse blocks in them. They used a few in-line fuses in certain places and a breaker on the headlight switch. So someone "hacked" in a fuse block from somewhere. You can get a generic harness with fuse block from Painless or EZ and wire it up. I do agree you should do something to improve what you have. Those blue crimp splices and various terminal ends are a recipe for issues and intermittent "gremlins" to trouble you. And what a pain for any future troubleshooting when you need to trace out a circuit.

 

[jeff_b]

'75-'78 CJs used a fuse block with glass fuses. After '78, you got ATO fuses. Pre-'75, those early CJs didn't have fuse blocks in them. They used a few in-line fuses in certain places and a breaker on the headlight switch. So someone "hacked" in a fuse block from somewhere. You can get a generic harness with fuse block from Painless or EZ and wire it up. I do agree you should do something to improve what you have. Those blue crimp splices and various terminal ends are a recipe for issues and intermittent "gremlins" to trouble you. And what a pain for any future troubleshooting when you need to trace out a circuit.

Your suggestion to rewire is duly noted. It's a hodge-podge under the hood too, and at some point, some PO added hood marker lights. I don't intend to add a bunch of high-current stuff, but would like to add capability for interior lighting, maybe USB ports and I'll definitely liven up that dashboard lighter.

 

[TSB8C]

With my rig, I have EFI now with an ECM, push button start, and numerous other electrical add-ons and changes. I actually pulled the stock harnesses (under hood, under dash, rear) to lay them on the dining room table and with a crimper and soldering iron made my own customized harnesses rather than buy from somewhere. Now I know every wire, color, and union front to back. And it was cheaper than new kits from EZ or Painless.

 

[jeff_b]

With my rig, I have EFI now with an ECM, push button start, and numerous other electrical add-ons and changes. I actually pulled the stock harnesses (under hood, under dash, rear) to lay them on the dining room table and with a crimper and soldering iron made my own customized harnesses rather than buy from somewhere. Now I know every wire, color, and union front to back. And it was cheaper than new kits from EZ or Painless.

Very interesting! Which fuse panel did you go with? Did you happen to make a wire run list I could pilfer?

With my rig, I have EFI now with an ECM, push button start, and numerous other electrical add-ons and changes. I actually pulled the stock harnesses (under hood, under dash, rear) to lay them on the dining room table and with a crimper and soldering iron made my own customized harnesses rather than buy from somewhere. Now I know every wire, color, and union front to back. And it was cheaper than new kits from EZ or Painless.

 

[TSB8C]

Mine is an '84, so I already had a fuse block with the ATO style fuses in it. I simply kept that, but removed and cleaned and soldered the connections. I also purchased some of the plug-in connectors to add additional circuits. You can check here for more info: Fuse Block Connectors

In terms of a wire run list, or schematic, I used the stock CJ wiring diagram, and then simply added the additional circuits I needed (dual battery, OBA, LED spots, power outlets, audio power amp, extra speakers, inverter, 7-pin trailer plug, map lights, towing mode, power for lockup torque converter, neutral safety switch on shifter, ECM, keyless ignition, heated seats, digital gauges, electronic speedo, etc).

eBay has some listings for NOS fuse blocks/harnesses for around $100: CJ Fuse Block Another CJ Fuse Block

To use an actual CJ fuse block, you would need the square hole in your firewall where the fuse block mounts under the dash and has the bulkhead connector that connects in the engine bay side. Not too hard to do, but you'd have to cut a hole to do it. Your other option as mentioned earlier is a generic wiring harness. You could get one on Amazon for $40-$50: Generic 12-circuit harness, or a bit fancier but still under $100: Another Amazon Harness

If it were me with an older CJ that had the style with the glass fuses, I'd replace it with one that uses the ATO fuses (I did that on a prior '77 I had). If I were in your shoes with an older one that had no fuse block at all, I'd get a CJ block with the ATO fuses and wire it up like a stock newer model. Plenty of wiring diagrams and help that way. Sure, add additional stuff as needed (lights, etc), but newer stock to use existing parts, diagrams, and other people's examples. To me, that would be worth $100 or so to get one. Lots of people have used Painless or EZ and paid $300 or more for brand new. Great if you can/want to spend that money. But if not, get a used one and work it over to meet your needs. You've already got a GM engine swap (that's what I have), and I assume different alternator and ignition setup with that GM engine. But easy changes to a stock CJ harness. Be a lot easier adding or servicing in the future with a CJ setup, even if it's from a newer model. Just my .02 - well .05 now since no more pennies and we're all rounding now.

 

[jeff_b]

Mine is an '84, so I already had a fuse block with the ATO style fuses in it. I simply kept that, but removed and cleaned and soldered the connections. I also purchased some of the plug-in connectors to add additional circuits. You can check here for more info: Fuse Block Connectors

In terms of a wire run list, or schematic, I used the stock CJ wiring diagram, and then simply added the additional circuits I needed (dual battery, OBA, LED spots, power outlets, audio power amp, extra speakers, inverter, 7-pin trailer plug, map lights, towing mode, power for lockup torque converter, neutral safety switch on shifter, ECM, keyless ignition, heated seats, digital gauges, electronic speedo, etc).

eBay has some listings for NOS fuse blocks/harnesses for around $100: CJ Fuse Block Another CJ Fuse Block

To use an actual CJ fuse block, you would need the square hole in your firewall where the fuse block mounts under the dash and has the bulkhead connector that connects in the engine bay side. Not too hard to do, but you'd have to cut a hole to do it. Your other option as mentioned earlier is a generic wiring harness. You could get one on Amazon for $40-$50: Generic 12-circuit harness, or a bit fancier but still under $100: Another Amazon Harness

If it were me with an older CJ that had the style with the glass fuses, I'd replace it with one that uses the ATO fuses (I did that on a prior '77 I had). If I were in your shoes with an older one that had no fuse block at all, I'd get a CJ block with the ATO fuses and wire it up like a stock newer model. Plenty of wiring diagrams and help that way. Sure, add additional stuff as needed (lights, etc), but newer stock to use existing parts, diagrams, and other people's examples. To me, that would be worth $100 or so to get one. Lots of people have used Painless or EZ and paid $300 or more for brand new. Great if you can/want to spend that money. But if not, get a used one and work it over to meet your needs. You've already got a GM engine swap (that's what I have), and I assume different alternator and ignition setup with that GM engine. But easy changes to a stock CJ harness. Be a lot easier adding or servicing in the future with a CJ setup, even if it's from a newer model. Just my .02 - well .05 now since no more pennies and we're all rounding now.

I'm glad I asked your advice! This rig has a very ugly hole chopped thru the firewall, and have a blank slate, but I like your idea of wiring Orangey like a newer CJ, your rationale is very sound.

 

[jeff_b]

Well, I decided to order a customizable Painless Performance harness, with fan and fuel pump relay kits, ground strap kit, and fancy split loom. Following excellent advice from TS8BC, (thanks again!) I intended to order the 22 circuit customizable for '75 (p/n 10106) and later CJs, but it wasn't available through Summit. I contacted Painless Tech Support, who said it's being redesigned and unavailable. They also said their p/n 20103 harness is identical to the 10106, but with GM wire colors! That made me laugh...... I came full circle from thinking about using a GM wiring scheme, ordering CJeep wiring, only to end up with GM wiring after all. Life is funny sometimes. I also ordered some adhesive heat shield for the hacked up firewall and tunnel to stick in there that might clean up the palette for the harness install. I should have all parts in three days or so...wish me luck!

 

[CJ]

I would say congratulations but you have some work in front of you. The good thing is when done your 40+ year old CJ will have modern wiring.

 

[jeff_b]

Thank you. Although it's my first CJ project, confidence is high. I'll take pics before, during, and after. Maybe I'll throw a build thread together if there's any interest.

 

[jeff_b]

Orangey Update 14 JAN 26

Not sure if I should dump pics here or not, but here goes:

1. Received painless perf harness 20103 and accessories via Summit Racing.

Got a sticker which should add somelow-end powah.

2. Gutted engine harness, started on dashboard and quickly realized the steering column had to come out.

3. Unfamiliar with Jeeps or GMs, (I may have mentioned that) I was shocked that the column pulled out rather easily. Thanks to the builder of this bad mofo, most of the hardware was fresh not frozen in place. The column wiring looked rough, so I began an uneducated search for a replacement. After no success, I finally regained some sense and decided to look for a column rebuilder. So I found one on the line........ (Link)-> Steering Column Parts, Replacement, & How to Instructions -<. After contacting them, I shipped my ragged column out, awaiting the return of a savory, refurbished, GM satin black column that should plop in as easily as it plopped out.


4. Pulled the dash panel out to reveal what appears to be a kluge of (20-year old) wiring. Check out the extension cord hack job. This is not high reliability electrical work.


5. Harness 80% out, will deal with tail harness after I prep the firewall to close all the holes and keep the floor cooler, then mount the fuse box and relays.


What have you guys used on the firewall and floorboards for heat shield? What works best?

 

[TSB8C]

Heat shields? Rugged Ridge rubber floor mats on a rhino lined floor isn't the best way to go?

 

[jeff_b]

Pardon my inexperience, but did I mention I’m new to these rowboats? The firewall has a huge hole cut and hillbilly-patched to clear the distributor:

I’m trying different materials to help block or divert some of the heat and fumes.


So, to answer you, oh wise sage of the oldest CJ community:
Yes, heat shield.

 

[TSB8C]

Ah, now I see. Of course my comment was intended to be a bit sarcastic/joking - plus I thought you meant something under the floorboards to block heat from the exhaust. I see now you were referring to the firewall and engine heat through a large hole.

Yes, you do have an interesting "design" some PO did to clear the dizzy on a Chevy engine. I've seen a lot of CJs with Chevy engines, including my own, where no cutout in the firewall was needed. But I have seen one or two where the engine was placed far enough back that it was done. In the cases I've seen like this, a piece of sheet metal was curved and used to insert into the hole from the engine bay side and then pop riveted to the firewall on the two sides. No real "shielding" per se, just to cover the opening. The CJ firewall has no real heat shielding any way, in terms of any padded or insulating properties. It's just a piece of steel as part of the tub.

You can buy an entire new firewall for around $250. Your pic doesn't look like the dizzy needs as big a hole as what you've got. Of course maybe the hole is that tall to allow the dizzy to be pulled if ever needed. If the engine were moved forward just a bit, you would no longer need the hole and could just replace the firewall and not have this issue. But yea, that's a lot of work with engine mounts, linkages, maybe heater hoses, etc. Or perhaps an HEI small cap dizzy with external coil might eliminate the need for the hole altogether without moving the engine at all.


Speedway Motors offers a "firewall recess" made from fiberglass for this exact purpose. But since you already have a larger hole to deal with, their fiberglass insert doesn't look like it would fit. But it's a fiberglass insert, not any type of insulated heat shielding type of option. Maybe you could just make your own fiberglass insert the size/shape you need. Easy-peasy and an air-tight seal.


Your last pic showing that heat shielding material looks pretty good to me, although you obviously need to determine how to seal all around the edges once you decide on something permanent as well as needed clearance if you ever need to pull the dizzy.

 

[jeff_b]

Great insight, thank you! You know, if I were 30 years younger, with a couple of good hands to help, I would definitely replace that firewall. But out here at the northern edge of the Ozarks, help for this Yankee transplant is nonexistent. I can't even get a roofing company to return an estimate for my wrecked barn roof! Anyways, the flexible foil shield is adhesive-backed but I intend to spray the firewall first with spray silicone insulation to give it a good surface to stick to. I'll test the spray to see how it sets up, then test the foil adhesion to the silicone. You make a great point about the available clearance for removing the distributor. If it comes to it, I can slice through the foil, pull the spark shootarounder, then sticky-side slap a new piece over it when done.

Unrelated to electrical.....the engine is mounted unlike anything I've seen.


I think it forced removal of the mechanical fuel pump.


Does anyone recognize this hefty setup?

 

[TSB8C]

Yes. I've seen those before. In fact, you can buy them on Amazon for less than $100. Speedway Motors part # 1356023. They're intended for universal mounting applications of SBC engines in non GM vehicles.