Viewing the World from flat on your back

[brian613]

yea there very expensive but if there is a place around that works on heavy equipment you can get in good with them and borrow one like i do

 

[DHugg]

Brian, it (torque multiplier) would work. I have in my head a big turnbuckle; pretty easy to get here is the Gulf ship-building trades. I have more experience with 'em than I need, or want. Once I get one laid out along the length of the steering shaft, an idea will come to me about how best to attach to exert the force I want. It will be fun trying to make a tool out of parts that seemingly don't go together.

 

[DHugg]

Re: Viewing the World - an AMC20 INNER SEAL question

I have this quote from a thread on another Jeep forum: quote Title: Re: Pulling hubs off axles
Post by scott on 08/26/09 at 23:42:29 jimjam, You can replace the inner seal without pulling the hub, & the inner seal is the important one. The inner keeps the gear lube in the rear end, the outer seal keeps the grease in between the outer seal & inner seal. Since grease is thick, there seems to be less problem with it leaking past the outer seal. Once you have the axle- hub- backing plate assembly pulled, the seal will pop right out. Pop a new one in & you're good to go, after packing the wheel bearings with grease. Now, if when you pull the axles the bearings or races look bad, then the hubs do have to come off & the bearings replaced, along with the outer seal. That's why I say to take the nut off before disassembling everything: just in case the bearings are bad & it all has to come apart. I've been lucky I guess & have had nice bearings when I've taken things apart this way.

If the axles are stubborn coming out of the housing, do this: Put the brake drum on backwards, & thread the lug nuts on a few turns. Slide the drum out , using it to bang against the lug nuts. This is a poor man's slide hammer, & will usually pop a stubborn axle out.

Be sure to check the axle end play per the service manual before you take it apart. Keep track of any shims on the left axle when it comes apart. Check the end play when it goes back together too. The only time I had a leaker was when I had the end play way off. once it was set correctly, the leaking stopped.
end quote

If the quote is accurate, I conclude that the a leak between backing plate and hub assembly (see photo) is a leaking inner seal. Further, I can replace the inner seal W/O pulling the hub by taking out the entire axle assembly.


I'm going to look up the exploded views in the shop manual, but perhaps someone has already dealt with this and can answer my question: There HAS to be a gasket between the backing plate and the hub assembly. What I am reading is that I MUST pull the hub, removing bearings and seals, to replace the gasket between the hub plate and the brake backing plate, the one I think HAS to be there.

Any takers? The reason I am not going immediately to one-piece axles is that, down the road, and close, I intend to replace the entire AMC20 with something that has discs on the rear.

I know you all realize how much trouble American Motors unloaded onto thousands of Jeep owners just to shorten their assembly line a couple steps so they could make more money. I like free enterprise, but not when the pursuit of profit violates good mechanical sense.

 

[Old Dog]

Yes that is the inner seal leaking (out of the bottom weap hole)
I have never seen a gasket in there, just wipe a thin layer of rtv and your good to go.

 

[DHugg]

I've gotten good advice, a lotta help, from posts on this topic. Now I have enough data to do something with.


When I pulled the leaking-side axle today (not with this whimpy puller)


I found what I consider a "train wreck"

It looks like an axle rebuild to me. So if I gotta go there (I DO!), then the only thing that makes sense is one-piece.


By the time the new axles arrive (UPS is gonna hate me), I'll have the brake parts cleaned and the backing plates fully populated with brake parts.

Thanks again for humoring my obstinacy, and for pointing out the glaringly obvious.

DHugg

 

[DHugg]

Old Dog, I am pulling back to a new position; new one-pieces!

See my last post, and thanks.

Dhugg

 

[Old Dog]

By the time the new axles arrive (UPS is gonna hate me), I'll have the brake parts cleaned and the backing plates fully populated with brake parts.

The shinny spot on the axle is where the seal rides (I think from the pic) if it is still smooth it will be ok.

Do NOT put any parts on the backing plate as it gets shandwiched in between the axle flange and the bearing on the one piece axles. Its a lot easier to press everything together that way.

 

[IOPort51]

please take lots of shots of the axle install. This is about #3 on my project list, I can't wait to see how this turns out.

 

[DHugg]

You got it, IO. I'll cover every change with a photo, including the trip to the local machine shop for bearing press-on.

DHugg

 

[IOPort51]

You got it, IO. I'll cover every change with a photo, including the trip to the local machine shop for bearing press-on.

DHugg

See if you can take a legible shot of the instructions especially the shimming and adjusting the end play.

I shall speak kindly of you to people you don’t know, when you are not around.

Where did you order the axles?

 

[DHugg]

IO, I actually had to hunt a bit for Superior or Moser axles. Found them here

Superior Evolution Series AMC20 One-Piece Axle Kit (76-81 CJ7, 76-83 CJ5)

at better than two other places.

I downloaded a PDF that is supposed to be the install, a 2-pager.

Not usually awake this late; just watched the Saints overwhelm the Pats.

DHugg

 

[DHugg]

IO, I actually had to hunt a bit for Superior or Moser axles. Found them here

Superior Evolution Series AMC20 One-Piece Axle Kit (76-81 CJ7, 76-83 CJ5)

at better than two other places.

I downloaded a PDF that is supposed to be the install, a 2-pager.

DHugg

Update on the attached PDF:
I just got off the phone with Superior Axle & Gear concerning the measurements in Chart A in the install guide. I could not match the axle side lengths of my 1980 CJ7 AMC20 rear axle with the numbers for kit EV20E.

Superior tech support (BTW, we started out speaking English, and finished the conversation that way) confirmed that the Length B, PAX side, for EV20E has a MISPRINT.

There was a "3" inserted instead of the correct "2", making the Length B, Passenger side, measurement 24 3/4 inches. The EV20E kit is correct for my 1980 CJ-7 AMC 20 rear axle; this is called the "narrow spread" or "narrow" axle.

Don't want to lead anyone astray, even by accident.

DHugg