258 Cracked Block?

[Ctknorr]

If you've been following me you know I'm on a journey.

This past weekend after an engine stall (vapor lock), I rerouted the fuel lines away from the heat sources that caused this problem.

After I staying new starter, solenoid and muffler my Girl and I took her or for a test drive. It had been two weeks since we had driven her.

Out for a spin around the block and a belt started squeezing so we came home to the tools to see which one is loose. Neither. So applied some belt dressing and headed out.

Belt started squeaking again so we came home after filling up at a gas station to have another look.

That's when my GF noticed this:

Has any body else seen this and successfully repaired?

I know one welder in Nebraska that can do it but to get him here or take this there would be about the same cost as swapping engines again.

I live in central Florida s if you know a solid way to diy I'm interested. If you know a competent welder around these parts that has welded cast before I would like to know your thoughts.

CK


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[Captainlance]

Forget welding, you need a new engine.

If you've been following me you know I'm on a journey.

This past weekend after an engine stall (vapor lock), I rerouted the fuel lines away from the heat sources that caused this problem.

After I staying new starter, solenoid and muffler my Girl and I took her or for a test drive. It had been two weeks since we had driven her.

Out for a spin around the block and a belt started squeezing so we came home to the tools to see which one is loose. Neither. So applied some belt dressing and headed out.

Belt started squeaking again so we came home after filling up at a gas station to have another look.

That's when my GF noticed this:

Has any body else seen this and successfully repaired?

I know one welder in Nebraska that can do it but to get him here or take this there would be about the same cost as swapping engines again.

I live in central Florida s if you know a solid way to diy I'm interested. If you know a competent welder around these parts that has welded cast before I would like to know your thoughts.

CK


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[Lumpy Grits]

That's next to the water jacket. Your coolant maybe lacking in anti-freeze,
Rebuild time, that block can't even be used as a 'core'.
Sorry
LG

 

[Manic Mechanic]

as stated you need a new engine lucky for you AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l are a dime a dozen

 

[coldair]

It's junk my 86 had the same problem when I bought it guy tried to weld it with nickel welding rod didn't work out for him so he gave up on the project.

 

[Ctknorr]

It's junk my 86 had the same problem when I bought it guy tried to weld it with nickel welding rod didn't work out for him so he gave up on the project.

There is a ton of knowledge in this forum and it's been a boatload of help for me for several months here.

I just want to share with every one, Cast Iron can be welded. You just need to know what to do. Lincoln welding explains on their website http://m.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/support/welding-how-to/Pages/welding-cast-iron-detail.aspx
How to do. I'm not gifted with welding. But I have family in the welding biz for 60 years that have been. My father who (retired now) was an automotive machinist has been arm chair coaching me with this engine swap and sub-sequential repairs as well as several of you here on this forum. He has taken several blocks and t-cases over years to get welded. I'd be there today if it weren't for 1,700 miles. Which is why I'm looking for competence in central Florida.

So for me it's a case of finding the right experience to repair.

Imho it's just way to easy to replace a part.

Of course, I'm looking for another donor block to be ready in case. Plus I think with the issue that may have happened when jeep tossed the rear ds I'm looking at a new or rebuilt Transfer Case too.

So, would you rather pay $100 to play another two years than spend another 1,500 to replace a solid running engine?

I have so many other projects I want to do to the CJ vs swapping in another engine again.

I'm sure most of you can relate since we all just empty every pocket. [emoji848]. It's part of the fun.

And believe me every time I fix a part and it's driving again. I'm loving it.

Thanks again for all the input and help.

CK






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[007]

Well, you've been given 4 (now 5) responses and every single one tells you to replace the block. Granted, not all block breaks are the same - and some can indeed be welded satisfactorily. This break pattern is pretty substantial. Even welded, you're not considering the dimensional shift that has taken place, however small - it will make a difference particularly with regard to moving internals. You also don't know what weakened areas have been created as a result of this split. Again, you will be time and money ahead swapping blocks, and with the right deal, swapping engines or getting a short block.

It's a bad, bad, frustrating deal - but it is what it is at this point.

 

[Lumpy Grits]

I have never seen a iron block with that type damage to last long when welded.
The last one I saw was done by a pro-welder. I'm talking about NASA/Boeing certified welder with every trick in his 30 yrs of knowledge making it work. We all thought it would hold up-It didn't.
Me-I'd be looking for a rebuilt block.
BTW: You have no idea of the damage that was done inside.
LG

 

[Ctknorr]

Well, you've been given 4 (now 5) responses and every single one tells you to replace the block. Granted, not all block breaks are the same - and some can indeed be welded satisfactorily. This break pattern is pretty substantial. Even welded, you're not considering the dimensional shift that has taken place, however small - it will make a difference particularly with regard to moving internals. You also don't know what weakened areas have been created as a result of this split. Again, you will be time and money ahead swapping blocks, and with the right deal, swapping engines or getting a short block.

It's a bad, bad, frustrating deal - but it is what it is at this point.

007, thanks for the response. The break pattern being "substantial" was what I don't/didn't understand.

But hearing it like that helps me understand better.

LG

That's good knowledge to have too. And you're both right I have no idea what the inside looks like. It used to look good. But this is a problem.

And I've started the search fo another block the rebuild.

Looks like I may have to come out of my semi retirement to sell a few more things. I have a Jeep. [emoji41][emoji848]


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[007]

007, thanks for the response. The break pattern being "substantial" was what I don't/didn't understand.

But hearing it like that helps me understand better.

Well, I didn't want to sound so gruff about it. I understand and respect your desire to fix things. You have to with these antiques. But this is one that probably needs passed on as much as it stinks.

 

[Ctknorr]

Didn't get gruff. [emoji481]


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[hagar]

I'd try welding it.
You have nothing to lose.....but the attempt.

 

[hdgapeach]

I've successfully done it before, but it ain't a cake walk to do it right. And mine wasn't busted no where near the extent yours is.

Just to make sure you have a worthy block, you're going to need to pull the engine and tear it down and inspect the inside for damage. Ain't worth the trouble to just weld it if the innerds ain't perfect.

Then it's gotta be cleaned to death, put on an engine stand, grinding the crack zone, cleaned again; then, just maybe, you're ready to start the welding. The area needs to be preheated prior to welding.

After welding, it's mandatory to control the cooling! If you hear the "TINK" during the cooling period, you done wasted all your effort and have to start over with the grinding again to figure out where it cracked 'cause it cooled too quick.

After all that hassle, you'll be tempted to just smear JB Weld on it and hope for the best, but you'll never be confident with it.

All that being said; GET YOURSELF ANOTHER BLOCK, and swap the internal parts into it, providing they're all good.

 

[Ctknorr]

Peach,

Thanks for an awesome answer.

Been contemplating most of what you said. This evening.

Found a place about an hour down the road with a rebuilt block just need the covers off mine.

And found another AMC 258 i6 / 4.2l pulled for parts about six months ago.

I'm thinking about the rebuild to just give myself a head start.


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[hdgapeach]

The peace of mind with a known good replacement block will be worth the effort in the long run.

I wouldn't have welded mine if it hadn't been a simple push out between two of the left bank cylinders. I forgot to drain the block before winter and it froze. The only reason for plain water was I had just rebuilt and broken in the engine right before I was sent out of state for a year.

Took it out, tore it down and figured out it was just the water jacket involved. The single crack was about 4" long. I considered myself lucky!

Hope yours turns out better than you expect, when you get her back on the road!

 

[mtnwhlr]

Unless you want a #s matching build I would move on. As said before 4.2s are a dime a dozen heck I have one sitting in my garage. IMO don't wast your time and money beating a dead dog. Good luck

 

[Posi]

It is what it is
I'd V out the crack and use JB Weld
If it doesn't work, it will set you back a whole $3.60

 

[mriplaybass]

I guess what I would question is how did it crack in the first place. You're in
Florida. I doubt that it was caused by freezing. I would wonder if there is just that much corrosion inside the cooling jacket, and it just rusted through. I would take a welding chipping hammer and using the pointed end, tap about as hard as you would driving a nail into a 2x4. If you have substantial degradation inside the jackets, the hammer will go right through and you know that you're beating a dead horse.

 

[Ctknorr]

I guess what I would question is how did it crack in the first place. You're in
Florida. I doubt that it was caused by freezing. I would wonder if there is just that much corrosion inside the cooling jacket, and it just rusted through. I would take a welding chipping hammer and using the pointed end, tap about as hard as you would driving a nail into a 2x4. If you have substantial degradation inside the jackets, the hammer will go right through and you know that you're beating a dead horse.

I don't know what caused it. Engine was just swapped into our CJ from a newer ('81) Scrambler. Prepped installed and driven just over 300 miles. On Memorial Day we had a vapor lock from fuel getting to hot due to routing of fuel lines.

Starter burned up and solenoid went bad. Replaced. Check all fluids. Water in upper tank low about 3/4". Topped off, checked oil and restarted.

Drive around the block a couple miles. Have a belt squeal. Pull back in to drive at home, lift the lid and my girl says "what's this?" Pointing to the crack you see in the picture in previous comment.

No signs of it when we swapped in. But it's there now.

CK


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[Lumpy Grits]

Did you pay someone to do the engine swap?
If so-I'd be hav'n a few words with'em........
LG