Jeep wants to change ends.

[Hedgehog]

Now I have the Jeep on the road. My 360 pulls hard, I don't really need first gear, yep just 2nd and 3rd is all I need..... Not really but you get my drift. I do have a problem though.

The few times I've driven the Jeep its always done this and it's time to straighten it out.

When it accelerates it feels like she's riving, but no serious problem there. But when driving along at speed then taking your foot off the accelerator the Jeep does a hard dive at the left rear and jerks to the right. It's not fun, especially when in traffic.

Could this be a problem with the differential? It acts almost like a locker, but I have a regular old tru-lock on the back.

Tires are new, axles are straight, everything seems tight.

 

[harleydragon]

could it be shocks ??

 

[Sam5038]

Worn spring bushings causing the axle to shift forward or backward?

 

[Hedgehog]

New shocks, bushings, drive shafts and even axles. All the parts changed because they were warn out. The twitch is essentially unchanged. About the only thing left is the differential.

 

[BIGTRUCKNUT]

My Detroit Locker equipped CJ5 does something similar but I've got used to it after twenty-some odd years. I blame mine on the locker, short wheelbase, 4" spring lift, and extra HP provided by my SB 350 motor. I've learned to countersteer when getting on and off the gas hard (applies when shifting gears too). Works great in the mud/trails though.

 

[Hedgehog]

While I don't have a Detroit it acts like it does. It might be something I get used to. I am running with power steering and the original big steering wheel and the ol' girl is touchy. The slightest wheel wobble and I'm all over the road. I feel like a kid just learning how to drive.

 

[mstar]

Ya , sounds like you have a few things to "sort out". The Limited slip(clutches) style posi's have been known to get touchy from sitting. Try adding a friction modifier to smooth thinks out.My '69 did the same exact thing after restoring it.What I finale found was when I replaced the pitman arm on the Saginaw steering to the correct jeep arm I didn't have the steering gear centered.Dumb mistake but it sure screwed up the handling.I centered the gear and adjusted the drag link and added some caster and set tow-in and 100% better.Now drives like it did before I restored it,which was very good. Good luck and better days ahead . mike

 

[harleydragon]

While I don't have a Detroit it acts like it does. It might be something I get used to. I am running with power steering and the original big steering wheel and the ol' girl is touchy. The slightest wheel wobble and I'm all over the road. I feel like a kid just learning how to drive.

that sounds like maybe an alignment problem...reason I ask about shocks is,on my green CJ7 I put airshocks on all 4 corners.It stiffened up the factory yj springs and it handles better than any jeep I ever built no matter how hard I accelerate,stop or turn

 

[Barry2]

Mine does the same thing, new bushings all the way around and have double checked all pertaining nuts and bolts. I one time while testing a new fuel delivery system ran it up to 90 MPH and right back down...And it was SCAREY!!! This may have to do with frame flex under full throttle......Dunno.:dunno:

 

[Old Dog]

could be bump steer, how parallel are your tie rod and drag link.

 

[hdgapeach]

Steering geometry and / or alignment. Had the same problem with mine after reversing the shackle reverse thing. Every time I lifted my foot off the go pedal the danged thing would head for the woods! Got the toe alignment to specs and all is good.

 

[rockinreel]

Mine used to do the same thing while punching or letting off the gas. She would crab walk on me. Discovered I had a toe out condition. Fixed it manually based on the info on this site about how to fix you steering, and I don't notice it anymore.

 

[Hedgehog]

I'm deffinately going to need to have the alignment checked. With the massive amount of work done in the last year a 4 wheel alignment is in order. It does seem to be getting better though. with advice from another Jeeper the tire tire pressure was reduced some.

It was also pointed out that the Jeep has a '50s hotrod slant to it. There is quite a stack of springs in the rear, so this weekend a couple of the smaller springs will be removed. I'm hoping the Jeep will have a softer ride. Right now it's like riding in a bucking horse. While I'm at it the bushings will be checked. I'm sure they were replaced, but it's possible that not all of them were. I know the spring bushings were done, but it is possible that the top ones in the rear shackles weren't changed.

 

[Hedgehog]

A bit of an update on this older thread. While taking a VERY close look at the way my spring sits on the axle perch it is clear that the axle is turned up in the front. There is only a small patch or part of the perch touching the spring stack. This week end I'm going to remove a couple spring leaves to drop the rear end down a little and hopefully bring a softer ride along with it. Running with a little less air, ~25 lbs, made for a better ride, the spring change should help as well. Naturally while I'm at it the axle situation will be looked at as well. I might need to get some new "U" bolts as well. ..... and that long awaited air ratchet.

 

[harleydragon]

u bolts were my first thought when I read that the springs had a gap on the perch

 

[rufus1138]

i agree, new u bolts, re-torque, any update from the alignment? the comments about toe out condition coupled with possible caster issues could cause this, these short wheel base -5's are definitely very sensitive to torque steer, i would address these before removing leaves. definitely dont change too many things at once.

 

[Hedgehog]

Way last spring when I worked on the springs and their bushings I ws laying nder the back and it looked like the "U" bolts pulled everything together .... NOT! A rethink bringht to muind that there is a lot of friction to over come for the "U" bolts to do as I thought they would do. Now it appears that while everything is loose the axle needs to be set prpoerly in place then the nuts brought up evenly. Last spring the "U" bolt threaded portion was very long and like an idiot I can ocasionally be I hadn't cleaned the threads up properly so it was an EXTREME effort to tighten everything up at all. Clean threads or new "U" bolts along with the air ratchet will help the situation greatly.

RUFUS - The jeep has an rear high stance and the ride is VERY stiff. Even taking into account the fact that it's a CJ5 . I really don't mind a stiff ride, but this thing is way beyond that. I believe it's a part of the PO's excessive lift. I removed the long shackles and straightened up a few other issues like bent leaf spring hangers, but new springs were not in my budget. With 8 leaves in the stack removing a couple of the short ones shouldn't hurt. It's hard to believe the short springs actually do much, removing them might not change the ride at all. It will lower the rear end though.

Alignment: Money is short right now and I don't trust myself to tackle alignment issues. I did the remove the hands from the steering wheel thing and it tracked as if it were on rails, even when braking it tracked straight. To this point I thought the ball joints were good, but I need to lift the front again and give everything a good shaking as suggested in my Jeep shop manual. When doing a hard turn the Jeep does seem to "settle", for a lack of a better word.

 

[rufus1138]

wow, i can reciprocate with the po problems, im on my second full time liveaboard sailboat and the current one looks like the po would have whitewashed the interior if he had thought it would save some time, totally worth it when you fall in love with something tho, good luck with remedying the ride height issue, 8 pack is definitely excessive.

on the alignment thing im sure someone on here has done a string method alignment and could talk you through interpreting a reading. from what i understand all it takes is a length of string run around the tires parallel to the ground at center hub level, this should indicate relative toe for all four wheels, as long as the axles are true to the frame then it should be a simple process to adjust the rear to neutral and put an even amount of toe-in on the front.

 

[Old Dog]

A bit of an update on this older thread. While taking a VERY close look at the way my spring sits on the axle perch it is clear that the axle is turned up in the front. There is only a small patch or part of the perch touching the spring stack.

If the perch is no longer flat, it's time to weld some good ones on.

 

[Hedgehog]

It's not the perches problem, my mistake.

Okay here we go! Some disassembly took place tonight. Removing the PO's big tall shackles was almost the very first thing I did on the CJ. Needless to say I was a little rusty in the mechanical department at the time. Now I have a little more experience in looking for problems. So, what did I find:

As mentioned previously I was sloppy in the way the "U" bolts were tightened up. I did not mate the axle tube perches down properly on the springs. Then the nut torque was inconsistent. As it turns out they were inconsistent for a reason. The threads were damaged. Today I would have completely cleaned the bolt and found the thread problems. Live and learn.

What I am surprised by is the side to side slop in the springs. This is after previously removing the old bushings for new ones. I confess to not removing the top rear shackle bushings, they looked fine at the time, but probably weren't. All worn bushings will be replaced. What surprised me is the amount of side to side movement there is in the front bushing. That one is new with a little over 100 miles on it, the thing can't be worn yet. Something might need to be done about the holes in the pivot plate. What, I have no idea.

So, this is the proper time to ask. In a perfect world there would be no side to side movement in the spring stack. Not that the stack is sloppy, it's tight as can be. The movement is in the pivot and shackle area. But being a realist I know some movement is inevitable, do you know how much side to side movement is acceptable?

While I'm displeased with my previous workmanship, I'm pleased to see there might be some hope in getting rid of the CJ's desire to steer itself by the rear end.

I have found one spring in the stack that doesn't appear to belong with the others. The stock springs are tapered and smooth at the ends, the odd one looks to be simply cut square on the ends. Possibly from a custom spring shop. I think I'll start by removing that one first. It's one of the long sizeable ones that take a lot of the load.