The Definitive HEI and MC2100 Thread

[Petescj]

What this thread could really use is a bit of research on the soft dizzy gear for the V-8. Itd be nice if someone who wants this to be the "definitive" hei thread ( Hint Hint ) would work on getting us a part number for the 258s bigger brothers.

Thanks!

It was really nice of Shirley to give a gift that not only helped me out, but also put to rest the bogus info being thrown around, and can give a little peace of mind to all the many HEI and MC2100 owners on here.

 

[Rescue Diver]

Which HEI did you get? What one do you recommend and where can you buy it? All the ones I see seem to have the hardened gear which someone said wasn't good for the V8.

You can use any HEI you want, but I haven't read anywhere that says for certain that they sell one with a soft gear, so you'll most likely want to swap gears for one that won't eat your cam gear. I read on some forum way back that a mopar 360 gear will work, but I have no idea if this is correct. You could always order the gear and compare it at the store before you buy it? It's easy to swap gears. Just drive the pin out with a hammer and punch, and then just drive the pin back into the new one once youside it on the shaft.

I would definitely be very creful to make sure you have the soft distributor gear. I read a few people say that after installing an HEO in a V8 with the hardened gear, their gam gear was toast within a few miles.

I wish someone on this forum that's using an HEI in their AMC V8 would chime in with what works for them.

 

[Rescue Diver]

What this thread could really use is a bit of research on the soft dizzy gear for the V-8. Itd be nice if someone who wants this to be the "definitive" hei thread ( Hint Hint ) would work on getting us a part number for the 258s bigger brothers.

If I had access to a AMC 304 distributor I would be more than happy to go to a dodge dealer and take a look at a mopar 360 distributor gear side by side with the AMC gear. I only have one thread that I don't even remeber where I saw it where one guy said the mopar gear works. I would have to see it with my ow eyes to trust it.

If I remember correctly, the reason they said you can't just use the gear from an AMC V8 distributor on an HEI is because the shaft is a different diameter. That's why the guy said to use the Mopar 360 gear. I'd really be curious to know if this is correct!

Anyone??? Come on V8 guys, represent!

 

[CJ]

I'll make a post using a hard dizzy gear, a soft dizzy gear and how to use a hard gear without tearing up the cam gear. I have done them all.

 

[Rescue Diver]

I'll make a post using a hard dizzy gear, a soft dizzy gear and how to use a hard gear without tearing up the cam gear. I have done them all.

Well great! Sounds like there are some V8 people that are waiting to hear.

 

[Jessica]

I just emailed a person selling them and they said to use the gear off your old distributor. Is that something that is that easy to swap over? I'd really like to order one and get it installed ASAP as it's the best time of year for Jeeping here in FL and mine won't start . If someone could mention which one they are really liking and where they got it I'd appreciate it!

 

[83cj7]

Bulltear has alot of info. about dizzy gears along with selling a matched set if your worried about it. Too spendy for me thou. The directions that came with my dizzy said to switch the gear if you had any doubts. I used the gear that came with it due to the fact that I had a new cam gear and break in oil (zddp) additive still in the engine. As of now I have 1,600. miles on the engine and probably should pull the dizzy to check out the gears but the weather here is too crappy right now.
I've seen alot of info. on the AMC engine sites on the subject but then your going to see alot of other info. about how bad engine oiling on AMC V-8's are designed and how that effects the cam gear ,dizzy gear, oil pump drive and how they can effect each other.
Just switch the gears and call it good if it was me.

 

[Jessica]

I'm just looking for a quick, easy fix to get my Jeep back up and running without spending too much...Seems like switching over is a good idea if I can pick up the HEI for $100 and bypass all the other stuff that could be wrong with the ignition system. Especially if it works better too. Seems like a win win situation. It was working fine and I left my keys in accidentally overnight and fried something somewhere as now it wont start. If the HEI will fix it-- I'll get one. Just wishing someone would say what brand works best for the AMC 304 V8 and where I can find it.

 

[83cj7]

I got the Red one from ebay. Who knows if it's any better than the others. It did have free shipping. You should also know that you should probably get larger plug wires(8mm) and re-gap your plugs to.045. I also got the next size longer power steering belt to get a little more space between the pump and dizzy but the stock one would have worked. Good luck

As far as brands go, all of these cheap ebay HEI are probably overseas knock offs. Thats why so cheap. If you want a good brand name go to Summit or Jegs and get a DUI, Mallory or whatever and pay 2-3 times as much. I'd almost be suprised if some of the name brands haven't be outsourced overseas. The one I got looks exactly like the Mallory one Summit sells.

 

[Rescue Diver]

I just emailed a person selling them and they said to use the gear off your old distributor. Is that something that is that easy to swap over? I'd really like to order one and get it installed ASAP as it's the best time of year for Jeeping here in FL and mine won't start . If someone could mention which one they are really liking and where they got it I'd appreciate it!

I would hope the selle would know if your stock AMC 304 distributor gear will fit the HEI they're selling since they told you to swap to yur stock gear, but you never know? That goes against what some guy said on another thread, but most of you know how I feel about trusting most things I read on the net.

For the sake of argument, let's say that your stock gear will fit the HEI. If so, swapping gears is easy. Like I said before, get a punch and hammer, tap the pressed pin out, slide the old gear off the shaft and the new one on, line up the pin hole, then tap the pressed pin back in. Done!

It only takes a few seconds. You mentioned that you left the key on all night and burned something up. Check to make sure you have voltage at the hot wire for the distributor. You might have cooked your ignition switch. If you did, don't worry. They only cost about $15 and take 10 minutes to install.

 

[Rescue Diver]

I got the Red one from ebay. Who knows if it's any better than the others. It did have free shipping. You should also know that you should probably get larger plug wires(8mm) and re-gap your plugs to.045. I also got the next size longer power steering belt to get a little more space between the pump and dizzy but the stock one would have worked. Good luck

As far as brands go, all of these cheap ebay HEI are probably overseas knock offs. Thats why so cheap. If you want a good brand name go to Summit or Jegs and get a DUI, Mallory or whatever and pay 2-3 times as much. I'd almost be suprised if some of the name brands haven't be outsourced overseas. The one I got looks exactly like the Mallory one Summit sells.

Ditto! My super cheap less than $60 with free shipping ebay special HEI looks as well made as any mallory I've ever see, and it works flawlessly so far with coming up on 6,000 miles of use.

 

[83cj7]

Bye the way Rescue Diver, Thanks for the early info. about tuning the dizzy. I was not aware that you could adjust the Vac. advance and it's done wonders. You the man.

 

[Rescue Diver]

I've seen alot of info. on the AMC engine sites on the subject but then your going to see alot of other info. about how bad engine oiling on AMC V-8's are designed and how that effects the cam gear ,dizzy gear, oil pump drive and how they can effect each other.

I'm jacking my own thread!

The oiling systems of AMC V8's only have one fatal flaw that I know of. The number 8 rod bearing doesn't get enough oil pressure. The fix is to drill two holes in the oil galley under the intake and to run a copper line from front to rear, allowing some o the oil pressure to bypass th vave train, which allows more oil pressure to the rear of the motor. I did this with the AMC 304 I built for my old CJ back in the 90's. Info on this mod should be easy to find. I ran the piss out of that motor andnever wasted a bearing!

That's about the only real trick I remember from building the AMC 304 . I just ran the stock distributor in it. I'm not sure if anyone had even come up with the idea yet to swap in an HEI?

 

[Rescue Diver]

Bye the way Rescue Diver, Thanks for the early info. about tuning the dizzy. I was not aware that you could adjust the Vac. advance and it's done wonders. You the man.

Thanks. Just trying to set the record straight after some bad info was put out there.

 

[Jessica]

The ignition switch...the thing where the key goes??? I've ordered a multimeter but it hasn't arrived yet. The whole thing is frustrating. It sounds like it's really trying to start (especially with the brand new battery) but just won't. I'm really hoping I'll be able to learn all of this stuff once my manual and testing stuff arrive-but I'm not sure if I have the patience! I'm beginning to see why mechanics charge so much per hour--for all of the frustration!

 

[CJ]

Thanks. Just trying to set the record straight after some bad info was put out there.

It's not bad info, just badly relayed info. All who have posted in all the threads that we have had about this topic have been been correct in different aspects. They just didn't convey what they meant correctly.

I will add, there has been a lot of info missed in all the threads that run across this forum lately. As I stated, I will make a post (started it a little while ago) with my experiences. These experiences are not what I read or what I was told. These are what I personally have gone through.

I have used very high $ Mallory dual point, racing, billet, HEI and the cheap as hell Chinese HEI dizzys (not all my engines). The majority of the times there is no difference. I have use soft bronze, soft steel and hardened dizzy gears (that is a big story I will tell).

One thing that no one has talked about is upper bushing clearance, and even more important is upper shoulder to dizzy roll pin length. If the distance is not correct (within specs) and you reuse your old gear, you get two wear patterns on the gear (usually not a problem). If the shoulder to roll pin distance is not correct (long) it can cause oil pump shaft binding.

As I stated, don't assume that because it works or worked for you, others will never have a problem.

Again, I will write up my real world experiences and post them. Heck, I'll even get into how to make that hard dizzy gear work with your cam gear. Anyone up for a lesson on hardening and tempering? It's fairly easy to do...

 

[DHugg]

Again, I will write up my real world experiences and post them. Heck, I'll even get into how to make that hard dizzy gear work with your cam gear. Anyone up for a lesson on hardening and tempering? It's fairly easy to do...

CJ, I'd go for that! I have watched my Dad temper just about every kind of steel. I could use the knowledge to correct over-brittled gun parts, tough up some steel pins I am forever sticking things together with, and no telling what else. Be well worth it if you have time.

 

[Cheepjeep85]

Well now this is really turning into the definitive hei/jeep thread, good job everybody. But jessica the cheapest way out for you (if that's what your after) is to fix what you have. Points are dirt cheap. Hei is better, but more money than fixing the points system.

DROOOID2

 

[Jessica]

I'd also like it to start really easily instead of the 3 or 4 attempts it normally does (unless warmed up). From the posts I've read ppl who have switched over said that they notice a difference in starting. I took off the cap and the rotor but still can't see any points! I'm thinking they must be underneath the thing with the gear that holds the rotor but I can't seem to get in there. There is a small bolt that holds a small clamp on the back that I can't get at with a socket that looks like it might release the thing that is hiding the points. I'm only getting a very weak yellow spark-I have to wait until my multimeter arrives to really check anything. In the mean time it seems like $AMC 150 is a small price to pay for a reliable quick start. I'm pretty sure that with my luck I'd get the HEI and the carburetor would explode...

 

[CJ]

~~~ can't see any points! I'm thinking they must be underneath the thing with the gear that holds the rotor ~~~

That sure sounds like a magnetic pickup to me... You need to start supplying pictures. Please take a good close up shot of this "gear".